I though it might be a good idea to start a topic to help people who find themselves traped when they get into religeous debates with athiests or cult members.

Because one thing that really got me is that several athiests keep arguing that the lack of physical evidence "proves" there is no God. It always bothered me that I could never come up with something that would make me seem like a reasonable person (apparently, Faith is unreasonable to athiests). and I figured this out a while ago and thought it might help (feel free to use it, that is why I posted it):

Give me Physical evidence that Athiests exist.
They may respond by saying "There are millions of people who say there is no God..." and I would respond, "but how do I know that they aren't all lying, and that isn't physical evidence." eventually they will admit that it is imposible to prove they are athiest with physical evidence. The same is true with God, you cannot provide physical evidence (without a shadow of a doubt) that God exists, but he still exists. Generally, winning a debate doesn't move them to salvation, but it shakes up there beliefs and they will hopefully start questioning what they believe and why.

That is true......but if you think about it, they could turn that same argument around on you and ask you to give physical proof that Christians exist. They always seem to find a way to argue, lol!

But still, you do have a good point. There is lots of evidence for the existance of God (and a lot of it is physical evidence) but just because we don't have the exact evidence that they are looking for they choose to not believe in God. (and even if we did have the exact evidence that they are looking for, they would probably deny it anyway) Funny how they always want God to prove Himself to them. And He has to proove Himself in the way that they want and on their terms.

True, you can't argue them into salvation............but it sure does feel good to get them thinking and asking questions. :)

heres something that might trip them up:

ask them about the wind... ask them what physical evidence they hae about the wind, if that exists outside of what you sense, your feelings and what you can observe.

Oooo.....that's a good one! I like it! ;D

well thank you, but i didnt think it up... it's actually in the bible... in matthew somewhere (and i'm too lazy to look it up)

I think I remember hearing something like that in a DCTalk song. There is a guy that talks (sounds like Billy Graham or something) and he talks about seeing the effects of the wind, but never really seeing the wind.

I've heard several examples like that (things that we know are real, but we can't explain outside of our senses and what we experience)..........but I can't think of any off the top of my head right now. :-

o, wait, here's one:

Thoughts are real.............do we have any physical evidence that thoughts exist? ;)

a friend told me an awesome story once. i'm not sure if it's true or just made up but i think it's awsome:

-every first day of school at a certain university a professor would ask his class if there were any christians in the class. usually there was atleast one and sometimes a few. the professor chuckeld and asked if they belived that God created everything. they would all agree that God did. so then the professor would ask them, that if they belive God created everything, He created evil as well right? the students stood speachless and the professer delighted in his yearly victory. so the students sat down and that was the end of it. the students could never think of something reasonable to say. well one year, the professor was eager to do this again. his first 3 classes were all victories as usual and he confindently expected to win in fourth block. he went thru the whole motions as in every other year. a few students stood up and they all said nothing more than a mumble so he told them to sit down. the professor turned around only to hear the last standing christian ask the professor if he belived in cold. well the professor turned around thinking this was a waste of time. so he said of course i belive in cold now sit down. as the professor was turning the christian said that there is no such thing as cold. cold is the absence of heat. the professor said nothing except for him to sit down. the christian didn't and asked the professor as he turned if he belived in darkness. the profesor was now angry with him for being a distubance and prooving him wrong, so he yelled OF COURSE I DO! the christian said again that there is no such thing as darkness, it's the absence of light. so the professor was real ticked and confused as to why he was asking these questions, so he yelled WHAT DOES THAT HAVE TO DO WITH ANYTHING!?!? the christian said, that in the same like ness there is no such thing as evil, it is only the absence of God. the professor stood speachless and defeated..

^ thus ther reason I started this topic. so that when Christians are chalenged, they can stand strong for there faith without being torn down by the "Wisdom" of the world by using logical arguments/reasons.

yeah, all they have is knowledge and logic. we have wisdom ;D.

really like it's been said but pray for the words to say, most of the time they come. but for some reasons they don't. one big reason they don't is if u started the conversation and God didn't want u to.

A recommendation that I will share is suggesting that whoever you are discussing with reads "The Case For Christ". It is a book written by Lee Strobel, a former atheist himself, who set out on a long journey to disprove Christ's existence when his wife became a christian. In writing the book, he was eventually strongly convinced otherwise and was led to Jesus and became a christian as well. He was a former journalist, so he was all about finding rock solid information. The book is layed out as evidence in a legal case with Jesus in question. This would bbe a good read for those who want "physical" proof. That is if they are open-minded enough to actually read it. If they refuse, they are most likely acting hypocritical...as they would believe christians to be the typical close-minded people. :)
I would also suggest this for fellow christians to read, as it gives us a little confirmation in our beliefs and can affirm you when you yourself may question God's very existence...

but for some reasons they don't. one big reason they don't is if u started the conversation and God didn't want u to.


tru dat. ;) i've learned that sometimes God just wants us to shut up & listen. i was once talking with a teacher of mine. i wouldn't call him a Christian, but he'd probably call himself one. he had basically taken the Bible & made some of the stuff to fit into what he wanted. :( when i was talking to him after class, i felt God just telling me to shut up. too often i feel like i know the answer, so i just open my big mouth & spirt. but i kept quiet. now this teacher likes me, so i have an 'in' with him. so it might feel good to talk now, but sometimes it's better in the long run. :)

A recommendation that I will share is suggesting that whoever you are discussing with reads "The Case For Christ". It is a book written by Lee Strobel, a former atheist himself, who set out on a long journey to disprove Christ's existence when his wife became a christian. In writing the book, he was eventually strongly convinced otherwise and was led to Jesus and became a christian as well. He was a former journalist, so he was all about finding rock solid information. The book is layed out as evidence in a legal case with Jesus in question. This would bbe a good read for those who want "physical" proof. That is if they are open-minded enough to actually read it. If they refuse, they are most likely acting hypocritical...as they would believe christians to be the typical close-minded people. :)
I would also suggest this for fellow christians to read, as it gives us a little confirmation in our beliefs and can affirm you when you yourself may question God's very existence...


Yes, that is a very good book. Definatly reccomend it! :) Didn't he also write one called "The Case for Faith" ?

The best words are your testimony, cause you were there.

The best way is love, cause it's God.

I agree, Xon, our testimonies are our greatest tool in sharing our faith. True experience can't be denied. However, many people do think of us crazy from time to time...but that's when we leave it up to God to soften their hearts and a time will come when what you have told them will be of benefit. We must be content as a simple link in a chain to that person's salvation. Not very often will you be there when they make the decision of faith.

I though it might be a good idea to start a topic to help people who find themselves traped when they get into religeous debates with athiests or cult members.


I kind of like"The fool has said in his heart there is no God"...Psalms 14:1 ;)

I like that one too

...based on the "story" posted a bit ago on this thread, i could think of a better, perhaps response:

God did not create evil. He created us for love. this is why he did not make us to be robots (in a sense, because robots can only perform what they are told to do, if they are told to love (assuming a robot can love) then they love, but this is not a true love because true love springs off of choice.). this is why we as humans have the freedom of will, to make our own choices, so we might be able to love, truely; and also in this freedom of will, we have the option not to love and but doing so, creating a gap between us and God. that gap creates evil. (this is true from, as stated before, evil is the absence of God) in conclusion, we created evil.

We (not us, per-se, but Lucifer (which means the Morning Sun) have created evil ever since he (Lucifer) chose to disobey God in the First War as mentioned in Isaiah).

"Suppose there were no intelligence behind the universe.

In that case nobody designed my brain for the purpose of thinking. Thought is merely the byproduct of some atoms within my skull.

But if so, how can I trust my own thinking to be true? But if I can't trust my own thinking, of course, I can't trust the arguments leading to atheism, and therefore have no reason to be an atheist, or anything else.

Unless I believe in God, I can't believe in thought; so I can never use thought to disbelieve in God." - C.S. Lewis

I kind of like"The fool has said in his heart there is no God"...Psalms 14:1

Actually, when a word is in italics in the Bible, that means there is no justification for it being there by the original text. The Translators just thought that the writter wasn't being clear and put in what they thought he ment, not saying it's all wrong but sometimes it just completly misses the mark and even messes it up. In true form Psalm 14:1 reads...

"The fool has said in his heart, 'No, God'..."

See the diffrence it makes? It's not just fool saying 'there is no God', but he is saying, 'No (to) God'! Which can apply to us when we don't follow His leading.

"Suppose there were no intelligence behind the universe.

In that case nobody designed my brain for the purpose of thinking. Thought is merely the byproduct of some atoms within my skull.

But if so, how can I trust my own thinking to be true? But if I can't trust my own thinking, of course, I can't trust the arguments leading to atheism, and therefore have no reason to be an atheist, or anything else.

Unless I believe in God, I can't believe in thought; so I can never use thought to disbelieve in God." - C.S. Lewis


Lewis rocks. :) i love his logic that he uses to prove God. the first half of Mere Christianity, that's all he does. prove through logic alone (no Scripture) that God exists. then he gets into what exactly Christianity is about. he was so awesome. :D

The thing I love about colors and the absence/prescence of light is that...you can prove God's existence!

the christian said, that in the same like ness there is no such thing as evil, it is only the absence of God. the professor stood speachless and defeated..

I don't know why but all of the sudden I got a bit angry and wanted to back up things to prove God exists.

If someone ever makes the stupid statement of "If I can't see it, it doesn't exist"
Ask them if they've seen their brain?

to believe anything you cant see requires faith,but i personaly think i would need more faith to belive two gas bubbles(where did the gas bubles come from?) :obupped into each other one day and then a chain reaction of never a never ending universe occures and some how after millions of year we finaly evolve in to what we see to day (one thing the same scientist who belive this ,also belive that the sun could only burn of its own energy for a few thousand years,so if the earth has been here millions of years nothing would have been able to evole on a life less ,sunless frozen rock, and if the sun came along later and thawed it out then we would only have a few thousand years to evolve and , so on and so on.) what im trying to say is if you think about it there is no scientific proof that two bubbles can create a univers and in my opinion it would be easer to belive that there is a God who has the power to create and has done so , and in that sense there are no lose ends. and when you wonder about it just say hes the almighty God he can do anything . well that was a bit more than my 2 cents but i just wanted to get my point of view out there :-*