Isildur9473
11-19-2005, 03:24 PM
I normally don't post in the Garden of Gethsemane, because in all honesty, I don't really pray. I've tried to before, I'm sure it's definitely worth doing, but I still don't. I tell myself I'm going to when I wake up, but it just doesn't happen. I try to just force myself to, but 30 seconds later I'm thinking about other things, because quite frankly, I just don't care.

Since I got saved, my life has radically changed obviously. It seems like it was so much easier to live before I got saved. All these lifer-Christians tell me that they couldn't imagine living without Jesus, I couldn't imagine being raised in a Christian home. I just don't see a point to it all, salvation, Heaven, Hell, Judgment, why? God created this world, but sin is in it, nobodies perfect. So, those who don't accept Jesus go to Hell right? Why?

It seems so old fashioned believing in God. Apparently it's not really the cool thing, or the smart thing to believe in God so I gather from a lot of people I know. My family doesn't, I'm the only one on either side of my family, including all my cousins, aunts, and uncles. So does that mean my entire family is doomed to Hell? That really sucks I guess.

Creationism seems really difficult to believe in. Evolution really doesn't. Sure, both sides have really intense scientific arguments, but they seem to cancel each other out, neither having more credit over the other. I don't really know what I believe anymore.

How come Christians are right? Every religion seems to think they have the right one, so what makes ours so special? Why do we have instincts like lust when they just hurt us? Why doesn't God make it easier for people to get saved? Is their even such thing as a God? I know I've felt things from one, but if you tell yourself something long enough, you'll begin to think that it's true. You can make yourself feel feelings, you can make yourself think things.

I keep hearing all these people saying things like "God prophesizes through me", or "God really used that person", I don't see that. I just see randomness.

Besides the whole theological debate that's raging in my mind right now, I just seem to be getting worse and worse off. I lash out at a lot of you on this board, I don't know why I do. I don't know why I say such hurtful things to a lot of you, maybe it helps my ego or self image?

I just don't get it. Over the past 6 months, most of my thoughts have been about family. I really want siblings. It's been eating at me all the time. I was watching The Incredibles a few days ago, I started crying midway through, just at the thought of why so many people I dislike got siblings, and I didn't. My parents could have had more children, we make way more than enough money to have more than one kid. They keep giving me all these material possessions instead of a brother or sister, it's really not worth it.

People keep telling me to live my life according to the Bible. What would Jesus do? If I step out of line, certain people are right there to tell me that I'm not living my life like the Bible.

I see plenty of Christians who don't live their lives very well. Most congregations are full of losers, or people who say "OMG I LUV JEZUZLOL!!1" then 20 minutes later their out doing some non-Christian activity. Way to witness to people. The sad thing is that it's that way with almost everyone. Why do I want to be part of a religion like that, or believe in a God that have a large number of people like that worshipping them?

People keep saying that everything we do is junk compared to Jesus. Why? Plenty of people put good into this world, and don't know Jesus. Are they just trash, just rags? Isn't that what it's all about, trying to make the world a better place than what it was when you came in, not necessarily having an intimate relation with the creater of everything?

I know I don't have depression, I feel pretty happy most of the time. It seems to be my standings with God.

What should I do?

Maddog
11-19-2005, 03:35 PM
People keep saying that everything we do is junk compared to Jesus. Why? Plenty of people put good into this world, and don't know Jesus. Are they just trash, just rags? Isn't that what it's all about, trying to make the world a better place than what it was when you came in, not necessarily having an intimate relation with the creater of everything?
I think what they mean, is that compared to Christ, what we do seems so small. Not rags, and yes many non-Christians do amazing things. And it isnt all trash, some of it changes the world. BUT compared to Gods majesty and amazing wonder it just sometimes feels like it doesnt measure up. I dont really get i t either casue they sometimes make it sound like what we do we shouldt be proud of. But i definatly have my moments where i feel great about what i did. But maybe what they mean is, we shouldnt be like. WEll i met my quota with Christ so now i can FINALLY relax and get fat and ugly. I think it means. Keep going, keep succeding. In all that you do do it for the glory of Christ Jesus.
As for the Non-Christians, its like that BIble verse. They recieved all the reward they will ever recieve. They may do great things but they will never recive what Christians will recieve. You see the thing that makes hell, hell is not the fire and knives or w/e is the absence of Christ.

Isildur9473
11-19-2005, 03:41 PM
I think what they mean, is that compared to Christ, what we do seems so small. Not rags, and yes many non-Christians do amazing things. And it isnt all trash, some of it changes the world. BUT compared to Gods majesty and amazing wonder it just sometimes feels like it doesnt measure up. I dont really get i t either casue they sometimes make it sound like what we do we shouldt be proud of. But i definatly have my moments where i feel great about what i did. But maybe what they mean is, we shouldnt be like. WEll i met my quota with Christ so now i can FINALLY relax and get fat and ugly. I think it means. Keep going, keep succeding. In all that you do do it for the glory of Christ Jesus.
As for the Non-Christians, its like that BIble verse. They recieved all the reward they will ever recieve. They may do great things but they will never recive what Christians will recieve. You see the thing that makes hell, hell is not the fire and knives or w/e is the absence of Christ.

It seems really strange to me that a religion based off of forgiveness damns people still. As for God's majesty, I mean... great. But we're humans, we can never amount to that. It's like looking at a child compared to an adult. The adult can do a lot of things, like drive a car, or hold a job. The child can't, but the child can still do some great things, so why not honor them for that?

That Bible verse... why? That's the textbook Christian anwser, "They aren't as good as us becuase they don't know Jesus". Knowing Jesus has done things for people, it's great to know about the creator of the universe, to have a relationship with him, but why is that the only criteria to go?

Why can someone who puts a lot of good into this world an doesn't know Jesus go to Hell, but someone who just gets saved and does nothing else goes to Heaven? That's not just.

TheFireBreathes
11-19-2005, 04:29 PM
I see plenty of Christians who don't live their lives very well. Most congregations are full of losers, or people who say "OMG I LUV JEZUZLOL!!1" then 20 minutes later their out doing some non-Christian activity. Way to witness to people. The sad thing is that it's that way with almost everyone. Why do I want to be part of a religion like that, or believe in a God that have a large number of people like that worshipping them?

Well what does 'saved' mean to you? Humans arent perfect, so it can be hard for everyone to be completely sold out to Christ. People whome are saved arent perfect, other pieces of the puzzle are included like sin or Satan putting thoughts into your head. Or society telling you what things are "cool" and what not.

1st Peter 5:8-9 Stay sober and stay awake (on guard). Our adversary the devil roams around like a roaring lion, looking for someone he can devour. Resist him, stand strong in your faith, remembering that your fellow believers in this world are undergoing the exzct same sort of suffering (that you are).

We are in an on going battle between good and evil, and sometimes we retreat, or fall under the devils fire. We become the enemys POW, caught behind enemy lines. In this world of sin we live in and can be hard to always do the right thing. Its really cool how whatever you do, God will forgive you. You can sin 100 trillion times and He will still always be there. He's got your back. Thats pretty hardcore. I dont think I have ever even heard of a god who is as devout and as loving as Jesus Christ. Because He is the one who enlisted is into His army, by His own blood.

drumchick101
11-19-2005, 08:05 PM
Man, this is so hard. I want to reply to this now but I don't have time to. All I can say now is that there are reasons for those questions you're asking. I'll give you my opinion on all of them when I get a spare moment. I wish so much that I could have replied right now. You have good questions.

><sarah><

as~i~lay~dying
11-20-2005, 08:19 AM
Im not sure how to respond to all of your questions...but i know you just need to have faith.If you choose to be a christian thats what you need because a lot of things DONT make sense! And you really need to pray about these things! Just take a couple minutes to clear everything out of your head and focus on God...or right them down like a letter(thats what i do and it helps a lot!) In order to have a relationship and get to kno your friends youo ha to talk to them...well you can "get to know" God and then these questions youll get answers to or He will help you to just have faith and trust Him!I will be praying for you! =)

completely_nuts
11-20-2005, 02:15 PM
And you really need to pray about these things! Just take a couple minutes to clear everything out of your head and focus on God...or right them down like a letter(thats what i do and it helps a lot!) In order to have a relationship and get to kno your friends youo ha to talk to them...well you can "get to know" God and then these questions youll get answers to or He will help you to just have faith and trust Him!
trouble is (and I have this problem a lot), it's nearly freaking impossible for some of us to stay on the same thread for more than 30 seconds. If God would talk back, I wouldn't lose track of what I'm saying, but when I'm talking to thin air, I get distracted by EVERYTHING. No matter what it is. I've been distracted by the eraser on my pencil when I'm trying to write down a prayer. Anyway (there I go again), my point is that some of us simply can't focus for that long. It makes us feel like we're not actually christians, because when we try to listen for God's voice, we end up being distraced by just about anything. We're wandering around in a fog with absolutely no idea what God wants for us, because we can't force ourselves to shut up long enough to listen.

Isildur9473
11-20-2005, 04:25 PM
trouble is (and I have this problem a lot), it's nearly freaking impossible for some of us to stay on the same thread for more than 30 seconds. If God would talk back, I wouldn't lose track of what I'm saying, but when I'm talking to thin air, I get distracted by EVERYTHING. No matter what it is. I've been distracted by the eraser on my pencil when I'm trying to write down a prayer. Anyway (there I go again), my point is that some of us simply can't focus for that long. It makes us feel like we're not actually christians, because when we try to listen for God's voice, we end up being distraced by just about anything. We're wandering around in a fog with absolutely no idea what God wants for us, because we can't force ourselves to shut up long enough to listen.

That's a really good description of what I'm facing. I also find myself just not caring when it comes to prayer, I wonder why that is?

theelectric3
11-20-2005, 05:31 PM
it's been said that the problem with Christianity is Christians.

Sin is not God's problem. it's our problem. adam and eve willingly disobeyed God (which is sin) and passed that on to every human being (since they were the first man and woman created by God). God has already defeated evil. Jesus came and through His blood poured out, conqured sin and restored our communication with God. so those who say "how can a loving God make evil?" the answer is that He did not.

so why does God send people to hell? He doesn't send anyone to hell. we chose our destination and by rejecting Jesus (who is life), we embrace satan (who is death). why is it like that? because He is a King. He has done everything for us...and if we still willingly chose to reject Him, then we chose hell.

why was hell created? for Lucifer and his angels. Lucifer was in charge of worship and thought he had God figured out and rebelled. so God kicked him out of heaven. it wasn't created with the intention to send humans there.

God IS Love.

Even though He did not create the evil, He still (out of love) chose to provide a way of forgiveness and redemption to mankind. it is up to us to accept His gift. That's what sets Christianity apart from other religions. other religions demand you to do certain rituals and you might get into Heaven. there is no guarentee.

with Christianity, God paid off our debt and simply asks us to accept what He has done. and in Him, we have assurance of going to Heaven when we die.

why do christians say one thing and live the other? because we have not fully surrendered our lives to Christ Jesus as we claim. lives speak louder than memorized phrases.

it is so easy for all of us to get caught up into viewing prayer as a ritual. you say these words, you pray this long and you get results. but it's not like that. another word for prayer is communication. it's simply talking to God, and listening to His voice. this takes practice and discipline. yes it is easier to do other things because our flesh (or sin nature) would rather be doing anything else than talking to God.

We were made in the image and likeness of God. He has feelings too. And just like anybody else, until we take time to talk a person...we will never fully know them.

why pray (or talk to God)? Because He did so much just so we could talk with Him again and get to know Him. No one else has given His life for me, for you, like Jesus. It's worth getting to know Him...to thank Him... after all He has done, the least we can do is surrender our all to Him and develop that relationship.

why did Jesus come and pay off our debts through His shed blood and ripped flesh? because we are the apple of our Father's eye. (God being our Father.) yes... we are that valuble to Him.

and that right there, gives me the motivation to seek Him. to KNOW Him. even in times when i'd rather be doing something else.

no one loves me like God. no one loves you like God. our Father. :)

john316
11-20-2005, 05:58 PM
Hey Greg

I think we all could use a better prayer life myself included...i think maybe you are putting too much pressure on yourself...prayer is a personal thing and how long and how much you pray is between you and God...i suggest that you spend as much time as possible in the word and then ask the Holy Spirit to give you a desire to pray.

I wish i could give you definite answers to all your questions but alas i cant...i have no formal bible training..i'm just a country boy who loves God but you are right about so many "Christians" that live one life in church but another outside...all i can say is even thought it does seem that most are that way there is still a remnant of believers that strive to live a sin-free life...are we perfect of course not but that is where the Holy Spirit comes into play...if i do something i know is wrong He lets me know...then its up to me to do something about it.I think of the prophet Elijah in the bible...one time he told God that he was the only one living right but God told him that there were 7000 other ppl that were serving Him besides Elijah...so they are out there.

I prolly havnt been much help to you but i will be praying for you...thats what true believers do... pray for each other.

Be blessed my young brother

John

drumchick101
11-20-2005, 06:58 PM
Ya, definetly what John and Tracy said...

It is very much about dicipline, and I must confess it is hard to get started, but once you do it will be easier to keep it going. You just have to break the first barrier. There will be more obstacles along the way but you will know where to go, you will know--not just with your mind but in your heart--where your help comes from. This is another "memorized phrase" and doesn't mean much to you. That is because He has not shown it to you in personal way. That is where those phrases come from and they are often abused from people who don't know His personally enough to get their own phrases. You will know if they are "faking it", just look into their eyes.

But it is obnoxious when you meet those types of christians that you described and may I add that I find it hilarious the way you described them. It is true though, there is a girl from my school who I saw at a meeting once on a friday night and I was shocked and exited to see that she was there and worshiping by choice. I had no idea that she was a christian. However, I felt crappy about myself because I couldn't let myself believe what I was seeing, I thought I was judging her to be fake. It was no judgment...it was in fact my decernment (my holy spirit enduced "gut" if you will). I wouldn't let myself believe this until I was reminded the following Monday of who she realy was. In history, she was talking about how drunk she was saturday night and saying the "f" word every five seconds. The truth is what Tracy said, they do not know Him, they just go from one "God high" to another. They feel great in church, but church is just another activity in their lives. They do not see that christianity is about everything you do outside of church, who cares how you act in church if it does not refelct what you do everywhere else? I sopose they think that God puts His little blinders on when they leave church, or perhaps they just don't care. I have never understood these people.

But you...can be different, you are called to be different. I find in some of the things that you said that you are so much like I was before God did some major reconstruction. I think He is revealing these things to you because He wants to work on them on your life. He wants to get to know you, and rightfully so, you are quite an interesting person. I think the first thing He wants to do to you is soften you. You say mean things because you have not had His love soften you. (But may I say, cut yourself some slack, I was much worse than you. And by the way it's okay! ;D). You see the people at your church as "loosers" because you have not had the opportunity to see them through His eyes. Now, the "fake" christians that you were referring to are not the type of losers that I'm talking about. I'm talking about the "freaks". God loves the freaks!!!! When God softens you, you will begin to see that, and you will begin to love them as well.

I think you should just ask God to make Himself real to you, ask Him to soften you. How bad do you want your questions answered?? YOU must seek the answers. All anyone else can do is point you in the right direction but the answers to these questions are personal and won't mean much unless God shows you the answer in a personal way. Those "memorized phrases" will only be as such until He shows you a PERSONAL meaning for them or does things that will cause to make your own (& this is a pwerful thing). Seek, read the Bible (it doesn't have to be a million pages a day, just pick a book and read a chapter a day). Ask HIM these questions and ask HIM to give you the answers. Establish a connection with Him. You don't have to spend hours a day. For me, all I did was tell Him how my day went every night before I went to bed. It took time, but it grew from there. If you are seeking, He will give you the answers that you seek.

><sarah><

PS. I love your humility John, I should learn a thing or two from you...

NightCrawler
11-20-2005, 11:04 PM
Simply said, if I am online and you wanna talk. Talk, please. Especially because I could help try to answer a lot of your questions, but I must get some sleep... and I don't want to forget about this thread.

Maddog
11-21-2005, 06:59 AM
I really wish I could help you greg. I just dont think I am wise enough to answer your questions. But my heart aches for you and I am going to keep praying.
I love you
Madd~