TheFireBreathes
11-20-2005, 06:29 PM
There is much talk these days about lost books of the Bible. From cults to the New Age, people make all sorts of claims about how the Bible is missing books, books that help justify what they hope to believe. Sometimes people claim that the Bible was edited to take out reincarnation, or the teaching of higher planes of existence, or different gods, or ancestor worship, or "at-one-ment" with nature.
The "lost books" were never lost. They were known by the Jews in Old Testament times and the Christians of the New Testament times and were never considered scripture. They weren't lost nor were they removed. They were never in the Bible in the first place.
The additional books were not included in the Bible for several reasons. They lacked apostolic or prophetic authorship, they did not claim to be the Word of God; they contain unbiblical concepts such as prayer for the dead in 2 Macc. 12:45-46; or have some serious historical inaccuracies.
Nevertheless, the Roman Catholic church has added certain books to the canon of scripture. In 1546, largely due in response to the Reformation, the Roman Catholic church authorized several more books as scripture known as the apocrypha. The word apocrypha means hidden. It is used in a general sense to describe a list of books written by Jews between 300 and 100 B.C. More specifically, it is used of the 7 additional books accepted by the Catholic church as being inspired. The entire list of books of the apocrypha are: 1 and 2 Esdras, Tobit, Judith, the Rest of Esther, the Wisdom of Solomon, Sirach, (also titled Ecclesiasticus), Baruch, The Letter of Jeremiah, Song of the Three Young Men, Susanna, Bel and the Dragon, The Additions to Daniel, The Prayer of Manasseh, and 1 and 2 Maccabees. The books accepted as inspired and included in the Catholic Bible are Tobit, Judith, 1 and 2 Maccabees Wisdom of Solomon Sirach (also known as Ecclesiasticus), and Baruch
The Pseudepigraphal books are "false writings." They are a collection of early Jewish and "Christian" writings composed between 200 BC and AD 200. However, they too were known and were never considered scripture.
The deuterocanonical (apocrypha) books are those books that were included in the Greek Septuagint (LXX) but not included in the Hebrew Bible. The recognized deuterocanonical books are "Tobit, Judith, Wisdom of Solomon, Ecclesiasticus (also called Sirach or Ben Sira), Baruch (including the Letter of Jeremiah), 1 and 2 Maccabees, and additions to the books of Esther and Daniel. The canon of the Greek Orthodox community also includes 1 Esdras, the Prayer of Manasseh, Psalm 151, and 3 Maccabees, with 4 Maccabees as an appendix."

Just started reading some of these "additional books", though they are not claimed to be "the word of God", its still pretty cool, here (http://www.carm.org/lostbooks.htm) are links to the other books.

terrasin
11-20-2005, 07:32 PM
The funny thing about that. The books of the Bible were actually voted in by The Council of Nicaea and were choosen carefully by relevance. Some of the other books that wern't included in the final "official" Bible I hear still make for good reading. It's not that they were all false or anything, not by any means. But if you read through some, you will see some of the reasons. Some were just worded better than others and got added.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Council_of_Nicaea

CJ

skynes
11-21-2005, 12:32 AM
I was told that the Council put those books but they had doubts as to if they were the true Word of God or not. The 66 books they were certain of, the rest they put in anyway.

When it came to the Reformation, Martin Luther went "screw this!" and took them all out.

I read a bit of the Book of Adam and Eve before and I thought it was really insulting to them. Adam and Eve had perfect brains with IQs beyond any human now yet the book portrayed them as helpless children.

Mr. Xcitement
11-21-2005, 01:25 AM
Where do you get the information about Adam and Eve having higher IQs and Brain function than humans today? As far as I have ever read, nothing ever says anything about their brain power.

skynes
11-21-2005, 02:13 AM
They were created perfect. They had no flaws of any kind.

While we use only 30% or so of our brain, it's reasonable to assume they used 100%, making them much smarter than us, also showing how they were able to develop so quickly, with their children being farmers and shepherds and another chld a generation or so later being a master of brass

(Gen 4:22 "And as for Zillah, she also bore Tubal-Cain, an instructor of every craftsman in bronze and iron. And the sister of Tubal-Cain was Naamah. ")

terrasin
11-21-2005, 05:04 AM
Yet they were still stupid enough to be decieved. ;)

CJ

terrasin
11-21-2005, 05:08 AM
I was told that the Council put those books but they had doubts as to if they were the true Word of God or not. The 66 books they were certain of, the rest they put in anyway.
When I first heard about the books of the Bible being voted on, it put me off a bit, so I had asked my pastor about it since he's part of some society of theologists who get together several times a year to discuss things like this. My understanding is that their wasn't so much doubt that the other books were the word of God or not, but they wanted to use the books to portray a specific purpose, and some of the books didn't really fit with that purpose. He suggested I find and read some of the other ones as well, I just need to find the time to do it.

CJ

skynes
11-21-2005, 09:35 AM
Yet they were still stupid enough to be decieved. ;)

CJ

Even as smart as they are, the devil is still smarter ;)

TheFireBreathes
11-21-2005, 09:40 AM
How do these people decide what book goes in the Bible or not? Is it by vote or how God spoke to them in each chapter?

terrasin
11-21-2005, 09:58 AM
I'm guessing lots of prayer and other discussion

CJ

NightCrawler
11-21-2005, 02:25 PM
Exactly as CJ just said. Prayer and discussion. And lots of it.

Also, I have heard 10% of the brain is used. How does anyone get that figure, or yours (30%)? I am not sure, but neither of those figures sound right. I am still thinkin' higher yet.

skynes
11-22-2005, 01:13 AM
Well could be 10%... I'm not 100% sure... I just know we use nowhere near our full brains.

terrasin
11-22-2005, 08:31 AM
I'm pretty sure it's only 10%... less in some cases I'm sure. j/k

CJ

terrasin
12-08-2005, 06:48 PM
I was wondering if anyone knows where I can find a list of the Books voted out by the Council of Nicaea? Or if anyone has read any of them, thoughts?

CJ

TheFireBreathes
12-08-2005, 07:22 PM
Is this (http://www.carm.org/lostbooks.htm) what your looking for?

terrasin
12-08-2005, 07:41 PM
I'll have to check with my pastor. Thanks for the link.

CJ

disciple
12-08-2005, 08:25 PM
These "missing books" did interest me greatly for a time, then I lost interest. I'm sure sometime I'd like to read them, and I'm also sure that they'd be worthy reading -- perhaps it's possible there's a message in them that might help with some confusion over Scripture? -- but in the meanwhile, I'll just do as God leads me to.

skynes
12-09-2005, 12:56 AM
One 'lost book' I know of is extra chapters in Daniel, about Daniel and a dragon.

Long story short:

Babylonians worshipped a dragon, Daniel claimed it wasn't a God. He was asked to prove it.

He made a mock-up 'hairball' and fed it to the dragon.

Dragon explodes.

Truth here: Myths of dragons all say that they had very fussy digestive systems and were prone to exploding if they ate the wrong thing.
Also it was actually a much older tale and had nothing to do with Daniel, but for some reason some guy decided to change it and stick Daniel in it. *shrugs*

aliengurl7
12-09-2005, 02:52 PM
Well could be 10%... I'm not 100% sure... I just know we use nowhere near our full brains.


Theres alot of sources that have different claims about the pecentage use of the brain.
Most of them say the 10% is false. but I don't think anybody really knows.


Anyhow... I've read most of the book of Enoch, its very interesting.

NightCrawler
12-09-2005, 06:37 PM
One 'lost book' I know of is extra chapters in Daniel, about Daniel and a dragon.

Long story short:

Babylonians worshipped a dragon, Daniel claimed it wasn't a God. He was asked to prove it.

He made a mock-up 'hairball' and fed it to the dragon.

Dragon explodes.

Truth here: Myths of dragons all say that they had very fussy digestive systems and were prone to exploding if they ate the wrong thing.
Also it was actually a much older tale and had nothing to do with Daniel, but for some reason some guy decided to change it and stick Daniel in it. *shrugs*
* shrugs * ...