john316
11-27-2005, 02:32 AM
I dont think this has ever been discussed here before...What are your takes on animal rights?....What is the limit on what is acceptable treatment of animals.

Of course you guys know that that i am a hunter...and i have had ppl insinute that i cant be a hunter and a Christian...that all killing is wrong but i believe that there is nothing un-bibical about using animals for food and clothing purposes....that said i also feel that even when used for food it should be done in a way that is as humane and painless as possible.I dont like the dispatch methods some commercial growers use.

Some animals need to culled...i will use deer for example.Despite liberal bag limits in my state I still see on avg 2-3 deer killed on interstate 70 every day when i am going to work..just think what it would be like if we didnt hunt them.

Despite being an hunter i really like animals...I have a dog that i spoil rotten...i love that little guy but growing up in rural country I was tought at an early age that there are pets then there are animals for food purposes.

So what say you guys?

newday_7
11-27-2005, 03:14 AM
I say eating them is fine, God gave us rule over them and He gave them to us for food and clothing too, i agree that u should kill them as painlessly as possible though, but also this made me think of sumthing else, what do u think about eating dogs or cats?

fire-inside
11-27-2005, 04:23 AM
It's not the eating of animals that bothers me so much. I was a vegetarian for upwards of six years but it wasn't necessarily because I thought eating meat was bad. It's more of the inhumane conditions and treatments of these animals. I'm sure everyone has seen the gruesome photographs and videos and heard stories about the living conditions of food source animals and the ways they are killed. The horrible thing about it is that none of it is stories. It all really happens that way. But eating meat is not so much an issue for me.

Hunting is something that bothers me. Only because I don't understand the pleasure of killing for sport. It seems like a horrific game, as far as I'm concerned. Wherein the hunter stalks the "game" and when they are finally sucessful in killing it, they feel... what? Satisfaction? Pride? I don't see how anyone can take satisfaction and pride in killing another living thing.

But the worst. The absolute worst. Is animal testing. I did several research papers in high school on vivisection and with each one I became more and more disgusted with humanity. It's torture. The "warning signs" of Jeffrey Dahmer being a psycho were his mutilation of animals. Yet the same practice is okay in the name of science? I hardly think so. I acknowledge and accept that certain advancements have been made because of animal testing - yet I do not agree that there was no other way it could be done.

We humans think we're such incredible creatures - but I doubt our capabilities when I consider the barbaric practices we have all in the name of beauty, science, fun and personal satisfaction.

All that said: this (http://www.hedweb.com/arfaq/arpage.htm) is a very interesting website.

terrasin
11-27-2005, 05:50 AM
While I do know some women who hunt, one thing we have to take into consideration is male pride. People have been hunting since nearly the beginning of time. At first it was all about survival. To be a bad hunter was to starve. Sometime later, it started to become a sport where men would test their tracking abilities against the lot of Gods creatures. They would come home with trophy animals and it boosted their pride as males. Purly vanity, really.

Now days, it's still the same for the most part. I don't know any hunters that don't eat their kill. Not to mention that eatting wild game is so much better for you than eatting store bought meats that are full of hormones. This was an argument that Ted Nugent had against a PETA member who wanted to outlaw BBQing. He got her to agree that eatting wild game shot in the woods was much better than eatting store bought food.

As far as the treatment of animals in bigger slaughter plants... I don't have much to say on it. I've seen it and while it might look cruel through human eyes, think that these plants are sending meats out to the world. They can't quickly hand pluck feathers and kill an animal quick enough to feed the countries population, which is why we have these nasty ways of killing them. It's what has to be done. People who are opposed to this method should be the ones who stop complaining about it and start growing their own animals like I am planning on doing soon and realize that the general population really doesn't care.

CJ

sky_flashings
11-27-2005, 06:02 AM
Animals have rights? o_O
I'm not one to believe that animals shouldn't be used for which ever way we want them. I mean, they were made for our use. I have problems with hunting/testing and stuff like that when parts of the animals are wasted for no reason at all, or they are being abused. I don't see a point in a.) wasting perfectly good animal parts to make other things for us, and b.) hitting them, testing freakish drugs that aren't meant for them in the first place, etc.

skelfy
11-27-2005, 08:19 AM
When I was in fourth grade (yes, fourth grade) I had a teacher who was a vegetarian. She was very open about it and since I loved animals a lot at that age, I gave vegetarianism a try. I also went on sites such as PETA and learned about animal testing and cruelty. Of course this stuff isn't right. I saw videos of animals having terrible things being done to them. It wasn't a simple hack-and-slash-cook-him-for-dinner type thing. These animals have to stay in cages with no food, water, etc. They are victim to torture. Right? I think not.

I guess the real question is how to stop it. Truth is, it'd be very hard to do. The people who have these jobs are still going to continue.

God put animals on earth for our enjoyment. But not so we could mercilessly kick them around because we're lazy idiots. I'm probably preaching to the choir, but I guess what I'm saying is don't abuse them?

bob
11-27-2005, 08:20 AM
Animals have the right to be tasty. :lick:

But seriously, I don't care how the animal is killed, like CJ said, it's the only way that the meat can be mass produced. No, I don't fall into the category of people that think that steak just appears in the grocery store, I just don't really care how the animal is killed as long as it tastes good. I know that sounds cruel, but i'm a carnivore . . .

terrasin
11-27-2005, 08:53 AM
Hahah, bob.

I have to add on the animal testing thing. Because of animal testing, we've been able to create drugs to save lives. Granted, I don't agree with starving animals and not giving them food. I think there should be some amount of compassion in the way the animals are treated. But if we didn't test these drugs on animals, we would never have these drugs.

Yes, I know we could test on humans. But at the same time, we are trying to save these people, not make their situations worse. How many people would we lose in the testing from trying to save them? It's things like testing cosmetics on animals that I am against. Things that aren't a need and are a complete waste.

I may sound very heartless in this, but keep in mind that I also have my dog I love and whom is part of my family. There is a difference between a family pet and animals we need for testing, such as rats. 95% of people would rather put mouse traps up and kill the rats themselves than keep them as pets anyway.

CJ

lamb_servant72
11-27-2005, 10:44 AM
I have to add on the animal testing thing. Because of animal testing, we've been able to create drugs to save lives. Granted, I don't agree with starving animals and not giving them food. I think there should be some amount of compassion in the way the animals are treated. But if we didn't test these drugs on animals, we would never have these drugs.


I agree. I haven't done the research on this that Rachel has done, but I feel if it is done in compassion, then I don't think we should compare animal testing to what Jeffrey Dahmer did. The purpose is completely different. The purpose of scientific research is to save lives. Jeffrey Dahmer only wanted to hurt animals.

john316
11-27-2005, 12:27 PM
Rach...I can certainly understand how you feel about hunting...because on the surface it does seem like it is all about the killing and i admit when i was younger i did want to kill my limit everytime i went out...and i am sure there are some hunters that feel that way but now for me the kill is secondary i like the thrill of the chase and spending the time outdoors and i dont make a kill thats fine tomorrows another day...and when i do make a harvest i always thank God for allowing to take one of his creatures for my substance..the below pic sums up my feelings after a hunt.

CJ...you make a good point about slaughter houses...to mass produce the meat needed there is prolly no "good" way to goabout the process.

Lisa...I agree the is a big difference between animal testing and a serial killer who gets his start by abusing animals

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/jmi1960/desmond20mccaffrey20thank-you-god20.jpg

deadb4dawn
11-27-2005, 12:30 PM
can a vegitarein eat animal crackers?

john316
11-27-2005, 12:54 PM
can a vegitarein eat animal crackers?

LOL..thats a good question

Heres another one....vegetarian(noun)an old Indian word for bad hunter.

sky_flashings
11-27-2005, 01:10 PM
Or doughnuts...they're made with animal fat, aren't they? Or are we borderlining vegans?

TheFireBreathes
11-27-2005, 02:00 PM
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/jmi1960/desmond20mccaffrey20thank-you-god20.jpg

Thats cool. I once saw a pic like that but it showed a soldier holding his M-16 praying in front of the cross.

as~i~lay~dying
11-27-2005, 02:31 PM
i think its ok to hunt....God put animals on this earth for us to eat! i dont like to hunt...but my dad does~~i do not agree with animal testing---

skynes
11-27-2005, 02:49 PM
I dont think it's so easy to say testing on animals is right or wrong. Beauty Products, thats a simple No. Testing blushes and lipstick on animals is pathetic and I dont like that.

But more serious things like Cancer treatments, medications ppl need to live are a different issue...

I think if it comes down to testing on animals and people die, because the drugs are untested. Or testing on animals and they live. Ill go with the one that lets people live.


As for hunting *shrugs* Not really a big thing in Ireland so I dunno... Spide hunting would be fun though *evil grin*

as~i~lay~dying
11-27-2005, 03:38 PM
I dont think it's so easy to say testing on animals is right or wrong. Beauty Products, thats a simple No. Testing blushes and lipstick on animals is pathetic and I dont like that.

But more serious things like Cancer treatments, medications ppl need to live are a different issue...



~~~agreed~~~

NightCrawler
11-27-2005, 05:31 PM
At the risk of sounding like a 'clonetrooper'... I agree with Scott and CJ, heavily.

fire-inside
11-27-2005, 07:04 PM
Or doughnuts...they're made with animal fat, aren't they? Or are we borderlining vegans?
Yeah, that's crossing over into vegan territory. That was always too much for me but I think people that can pull it off are incredible.

md4j
11-28-2005, 05:21 AM
Animals don't have "rights".

agent_c68
11-28-2005, 10:58 AM
I do believe that there is an extent that animals have "rights," but not to the extent that PETA put it. I believe that animals shouldn't be abused, but that is where the whole argument really is. When is it abuse? Some say when you beat your animals and torture them, that is considered abuse. Others, like PETA, would say anything short of letting them run free is abuse. for example, a rancher may consider it abuse to hit a horse in a way that could harm it yet someone who supports "animal rights" might say puting the saddle on the horse is abuse (would you like to walk for miles caring 200+ lbs of weight on your back?).

NightCrawler
11-28-2005, 12:54 PM
I definitely don't like the pamphlets PETA has been putting out. "Your mommy kills chickens!"

terrasin
11-28-2005, 01:23 PM
There was one thing that stuck out to me about PETA's war against KFC that disturbed me. About a year ago, they handed out buckets to children that were filled with fake blood and a small chicken inside of it. What kind of message can you be promoting to promote such a message to kids. I know if anyone did that to my kids, they would be walking home with a broken nose and possible kneecap (I'm Italian, capisce?). >=)

CJ

deadb4dawn
11-28-2005, 01:41 PM
Animals don't have "rights".
um... i think they do. i think animal have all the same rights as people.
i also think that animal abuse should be taken more sereisly. the estimates are that there are 60 million households in the United States who have one or more pets. these pets are considered to be companions and family members. like here in Missouri it is a felony to abuse an animal, even if it is just abuse #1. i thihnk it should be taken more sereisly cause people who abuse animals often go on to hurt people also. studies of prison inmates say that as many as 75% of violent offenders had records of animal cruelty as a kid. there is also a high correlation between family violence and animal cruelty.
and its not just that... i mean like, how would you like it if u were just put on this earth to be used as food? i know, everybody eats meat, but some people just kill there aniamls for fun. my boyfriend used to. the first time i walked in his house he had a dead cat in a big o' jar. OMG i almost pucked!
so all im trying to say is that if u know someone that is abuseing an animal u need to do something about it. "To do nothing, to say nothing, stops nothing."
and i know christmas is coming up. so if u are thinkn, or tryn to get ur parnts to, get a dog or cat or any animal that there is always the shelter in town. and the dogs at shelters are usily the better dogs anyways. all 7 of our dogs came from shelters, and they are all very nice and good with kids, well... all but one. animal do have rights, so treat them like u would want to be treated. cause what if God put u on this earth as an animal?

bob
11-28-2005, 01:48 PM
i mean like, how would you like it if u were just put on this earth to be used as food?

You wouldn't know, because animals don't have the same thought process humans do. God put animals on the earth so we should eat them, so I see no problem with eating them. Plus, they're tasty. :lick:

deadb4dawn
11-28-2005, 01:57 PM
the thing was do "animals have right", not "what about eating them". i do think animals can feel and do have the same thought process humans do. like im shure if they knew that they were going to go get slotared that they would try to stop it. like when i try to drag my German Shepard in to the vet office he wount move an inch once he sees were were doing. and my little dogs always got really exsited when we got neer the airport cause they knew we was going to Irland to go see my grandparents, and my grandmam and pap spoiled those dogs so bad. so i htink animals can think, and i know they have feelings.

Spiffles
11-28-2005, 02:01 PM
God gave man dominion over his creation on earth and he expects us to look after his creation properly. To abuse animals is to abuse Gods creation.

We need food.. animals provide a good source of food and it's not wrong to harvest and kill animals for food.. but that doesnt mean we should have those animals we would be killing for food to be locked in small cages untill they are ready for being made into food. We should still treat the animals the way God would want us to, and i doubt God would want us abusing his creation or having any animal go through vast amounts of pain and discoumfort.

bob
11-28-2005, 02:04 PM
Animals are not included in the constitution to be given rights, it's just a silly idea. Animals can't vote, they can't carry guns, they sure don't have a religion. So, I view the conecept of animal rights as a kind of silly idea.

deadb4dawn
11-28-2005, 02:27 PM
but what about rights like: the right to live, the right to stand there own, the right to entertain? things like that. nonhuman animals deserve to live according to their own natures, free from harm, abuse, and exploitation. this goes further than just saying that we should treat animals well while we exploit them, or before we kill and eat them. I say animals have the RIGHT to be free from human cruelty and exploitation, just as humans have these rights. Animal rights activists try to extend the human circle of respect and compassion beyond our species to include other animals, who are also capable of feeling pain, fear, hunger, thirst, loneliness, and kinship.

fire-inside
11-28-2005, 02:49 PM
God gave man dominion over his creation on earth and he expects us to look after his creation properly. To abuse animals is to abuse Gods creation.

We need food.. animals provide a good source of food and it's not wrong to harvest and kill animals for food.. but that doesnt mean we should have those animals we would be killing for food to be locked in small cages untill they are ready for being made into food. We should still treat the animals the way God would want us to, and i doubt God would want us abusing his creation or having any animal go through vast amounts of pain and discoumfort.
Wonderfully put.

terrasin
11-28-2005, 03:33 PM
deadb4dawn, by what you are saying, you are contradicting yourself. If you believe what you say, how can you justify having a dog as a pet? A pet is nothing more than a companion slave for people to make them feel better. If that dog were human, by rights you would be jailed if you treated it the same as you do your dog. So tell me that dogs should have the same rights.

People like to look at a boxed picture of a utopia that doesn't exist and was really never suppose to exist. Animals have to be mass produced to feed the world. Yes, it would be much better if they could all run free till the time they got put in the meat grinder, but it can't happen that way logically. It would be too difficult for companies to produce meats in any form other than the way they do now for the most part. But everyone has this little soft side that says "poor animals". You know what? If you don't like the way they are treated, harvest your own animals that can run free till slaughter time. Personally, I can't wait to get my hormone free farm started on my land. Not because it will be better for the animals that are being grown to be eatten, but because the meat won't be filled with nasty chemicals that are killing us anyway.

Many moons ago, this world was able to support itself through small farms and markets where fresh meats could be brought from farmers who did things right. But our worlds population prevents us from continuing that course apart from small nations away from larger ones. Nations that aren't controlled by capitolism and overpopulation. These are the conditions. You can either learn to live with them, or do what you need to do to change your own.

CJ

deadb4dawn
11-28-2005, 04:48 PM
i do do what i can to make my own. its not the point about eating them, what i was tryn to get across was the animal abuse. not the eating thing. it just comes down to the way u treat the animals before you kill it. and even if ur not gona kill it. like i said with the horses, he had no reason to drag the animal by its neck with a big o' chain behide his truck. that he had no reason to do, he just did it to do it. and like when those two teenagers burnt the puppy to death in the BBQ pit.

its not the piont of if they should be eatn its the piont of how u treat them b4 they die. and i treat my dogs like humans. the only thing that i wouldnt do to a human is leave them in the house all the time. this is just what i think.

skynes
11-29-2005, 12:22 AM
Man was originally vegetarian, it wasn't until after the flood that God gave man permission to eat animals.

NightCrawler
11-29-2005, 09:12 AM
Man was originally vegetarian, it wasn't until after the flood that God gave man permission to eat animals.
Genesis 9:
1 Then God blessed Noah and his sons, saying to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number and fill the earth. 2 The fear and dread of you will fall upon all the beasts of the earth and all the birds of the air, upon every creature that moves along the ground, and upon all the fish of the sea; they are given into your hands. 3 Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything.

md4j
11-29-2005, 09:15 AM
um... i think they do. i think animal have all the same rights as people.
i also think that animal abuse should be taken more sereisly. the estimates are that there are 60 million households in the United States who have one or more pets. these pets are considered to be companions and family members. like here in Missouri it is a felony to abuse an animal, even if it is just abuse #1. i thihnk it should be taken more sereisly cause people who abuse animals often go on to hurt people also. studies of prison inmates say that as many as 75% of violent offenders had records of animal cruelty as a kid. there is also a high correlation between family violence and animal cruelty.
and its not just that... i mean like, how would you like it if u were just put on this earth to be used as food? i know, everybody eats meat, but some people just kill there aniamls for fun. my boyfriend used to. the first time i walked in his house he had a dead cat in a big o' jar. OMG i almost pucked!
so all im trying to say is that if u know someone that is abuseing an animal u need to do something about it. "To do nothing, to say nothing, stops nothing."
and i know christmas is coming up. so if u are thinkn, or tryn to get ur parnts to, get a dog or cat or any animal that there is always the shelter in town. and the dogs at shelters are usily the better dogs anyways. all 7 of our dogs came from shelters, and they are all very nice and good with kids, well... all but one. animal do have rights, so treat them like u would want to be treated. cause what if God put u on this earth as an animal?I'm sorry but if animals had the same rights as humans then hunting would be illegal and so would eating a hamburger. So animals don't actually have "rights". How can we tell what hurts an animal truly or not? Can they talk? Can they speak their mind? Do they have a soul? Is hunting illegal? If not then they don't have "rights" now do they. Just because they are nice doesn't make them have "rights". Also God wouldn't have put me on this earth as an animal because I have a soul and I haven't seen any evidence to say that animals to have souls. Animals are here for us so the only "rights" they get are the ones we give them.

frymeskillet
11-29-2005, 09:15 AM
I think that killing and eating deer and what not is not bad, but I don't like to. I felt guilty when I ate my first sliver of deer. and I just couldn't put the visual of a defenseless deer eating plants when somone killed it out of my head. I won't kill a deer but i dont see anything wrong with it if it truly is for food and not for a trophy to put on your wall.

this brings me to another subject on animal rights...
a person can be arrested if they neglect a pet or train roosters for cock fighting. then why is it that woman has the choice to abort their unborn baby?? is an animal life more important than a human life?? I get really tired of seeing this happen. and thats really all there is to it. but now I'm getting on abortion and of subject...so I'll shut up! :)

-Savannah-

NightCrawler
11-29-2005, 09:17 AM
this brings me to another subject on animal rights...
a person can be arrested if they neglect a pet or train roosters for cock fighting. then why is it that woman has the choice to abort their unborn baby?? is an animal life more important than a human life?? I get really tired of seeing this happen. and thats really all there is to it. but now I'm getting on abortion and of subject...so I'll shut up! :)

-Savannah-
That is a very good point, but I must encourage you to make a new thread if you want this discussed. (and crap!)

skynes
11-30-2005, 12:23 AM
I find that ridiculous myself. Animals have more rights then humans...

Here's a thought on the animal eating/vegetarian argument.

Farms use up A LOT of land. the more people eating only vegetables there are, the more land that is used. If everyone went vegetarian and eating animals became illegal, how much farmland would be needed?
More to the point, how many forest/plains/swamp areas would need to be demolished for room for the farms?

If the animals native to those areas have nowhere to live, they die. Farmers certainly won't allow them among the crops, so where would they go?

terrasin
11-30-2005, 06:32 AM
I love how some people say that being Veg is a lot healthier than eatting meats. We've seen time and time again that you have to have a medium and can't go completely one way or another with your diet. To go completely Veg would create some complete lack of needed vitamins. Granted, you can take vitamins in pill form, but they didn't have those in older times which leads me to believe that isn't the way it was suppose to be. Humans love messing with the natural order of life.

CJ

Isildur9473
11-30-2005, 08:39 AM
I love how some people say that being Veg is a lot healthier than eatting meats. We've seen time and time again that you have to have a medium and can't go completely one way or another with your diet. To go completely Veg would create some complete lack of needed vitamins. Granted, you can take vitamins in pill form, but they didn't have those in older times which leads me to believe that isn't the way it was suppose to be. Humans love messing with the natural order of life.

CJ

Plus, what kind of man could not eat steak, and still call himself a man?

I've always believed we've had more rights than animals, simply because we're more intelligent. We've devolped much more, hence we're now the dominant species on the food chain, allowing us to do whatever we want.

frymeskillet
11-30-2005, 08:44 AM
That is a very good point, but I must encourage you to make a new thread if you want this discussed. (and crap!)

hmmm. maybe i will.... *wanders off to post a new thread*

skynes
11-30-2005, 11:10 AM
Plus, what kind of man could not eat steak, and still call himself a man?

I've always believed we've had more rights than animals, simply because we're more intelligent. We've devolped much more, hence we're now the dominant species on the food chain, allowing us to do whatever we want.

I don't eat steak, and I call myself a man. You got something to say about that? *shakes fist*

We have more rights than animals cause God made us that way. Nothing to do with intelligence, otherwise the dolphins are one up on us.

Isildur9473
11-30-2005, 01:57 PM
I don't eat steak, and I call myself a man. You got something to say about that? *shakes fist*

We have more rights than animals cause God made us that way. Nothing to do with intelligence, otherwise the dolphins are one up on us.

1. I do have something to say about that. :)

2. Dolphins don't have what we have.

skynes
12-01-2005, 12:56 AM
We do have something they don't, a Soul.
Nothing to do with intelligence or Dominance.

What are you gonna do about my not eating steak?

Isildur9473
12-01-2005, 08:57 AM
We do have something they don't, a Soul.
Nothing to do with intelligence or Dominance.

What are you gonna do about my not eating steak?

Sorry, but one of the requirments for being a man is a very large consumption of steak. Sorry. :(....:)

As for dolphins, no. We have a soul yes, but we also have other things going for us. We've developed into a large society, that's reached the information age. We have aircraft, we have art, we have music, I'd like to see a dolphin write the 1812 Overture, Dark Side of the Moon, or Behtoven's 9th. (I mispelled Behtoven). I'd like to see a dolphin paint the Mona Lisa.

NightCrawler
12-01-2005, 08:59 AM
Beethoven.

skynes
12-01-2005, 09:06 AM
But what is it about humans that allows us to do those things in the first place.

Those are just results of something else.
They are not the reason for our difference in animals, they are the result of that reason.

bob
12-01-2005, 01:24 PM
Sorry, but one of the requirments for being a man is a very large consumption of steak. Sorry. :(....:)

As for dolphins, no. We have a soul yes, but we also have other things going for us. We've developed into a large society, that's reached the information age. We have aircraft, we have art, we have music, I'd like to see a dolphin write the 1812 Overture, Dark Side of the Moon, or Behtoven's 9th. (I mispelled Behtoven). I'd like to see a dolphin paint the Mona Lisa.

I'd like to see a human do a double backflip jumping out of water, or jump through a hoop. :P

john316
12-01-2005, 03:53 PM
I'd like to see a human jump through a hoop. :P

Obviously you have never been married ;D

Isildur9473
12-01-2005, 03:55 PM
I'd like to see a human do a double backflip jumping out of water, or jump through a hoop. :P

I was making examples out of things that are productive.

But what is it about humans that allows us to do those things in the first place.

Those are just results of something else.
They are not the reason for our difference in animals, they are the result of that reason.

The fact that we're having this conversation right now. Dolphins couldn't sit here and hold this conversation. We may not have an exact reason for why we can, and they can't, but it's that way. We can't see God, but that doesn't mean he's not there right?

skynes
12-02-2005, 01:15 AM
The fact that we're having this conversation right now. Dolphins couldn't sit here and hold this conversation. We may not have an exact reason for why we can, and they can't, but it's that way. We can't see God, but that doesn't mean he's not there right?

Well I can give you a reason. We were created in the image of God, we have His personality, His attributes, His nature. Animals were not created in His image, so they do not have everything we do.

We are creators by nature, cause God is a creator, so are we. That is why we've made paintings and music and buildings.

Isildur9473
12-02-2005, 08:07 AM
Well I can give you a reason. We were created in the image of God, we have His personality, His attributes, His nature. Animals were not created in His image, so they do not have everything we do.

We are creators by nature, cause God is a creator, so are we. That is why we've made paintings and music and buildings.

I didn't think about that at all. Oops.

newday_7
12-02-2005, 10:03 PM
i'm more important and more valuable than any animal, simply because Jesus loves me more and wouldn't die for an animal.

unshakeable15
12-02-2005, 11:26 PM
I'd like to see a human do a double backflip jumping out of water, or jump through a hoop. :P
more importantly, i'd like to see a human never purposefully cause harm to another human.

dolphins are amazing. and they can communicate in ways we can't even understand. almost a sixth sense sort of way (they understand the needs of the people in the tank, so they can react to them accordingly). let's see you do that, Mr. Greg. ;)

skilletosis
12-03-2005, 08:57 AM
I get what your saying Mike. But I think it comes down to two things. We are made in Gods image (not the animals); and we were given dominion over the animals. Now since we are made in His image if we are following His example we will love the animals and care for them. While many animals are meant for food we should slaughter them in the most humane way that we can while considering supply and demand. There's nothing wrong with hunting for food. In fact if I did hunt you bet your biscuts I would eat what I killed and thier trophies would be on the wall. I don't doubt the intellegence of dolphins, but I realize that in Gods eyes I am higher than a dolphin. That being said I fully support laws and punishment for those fishermen who kill dolphins because they are eating thier catch.

Think about when the children were praising Jesus and the people didn't like it. Jesus replied (complete paraphrase) that the very rocks would praise Him. I like to equate that to animals also as thier very existance is proof and praise of Christ.

skilletosis
12-03-2005, 09:03 AM
Oh and speaking of the intellegence of dolphins... Last summer there was a story out of Australia (if I remember correctly) that went like this. A family was swimming just off shore when they saw fins and realized it was a group of dolphins. The dolphins approached the family and began to circle them. The family members became frightened of the dolphins. That is until they saw the fins of the sharks just feet away from them. The dolphins created a safety circle around the family and the sharks left. A creature like that could only be the creation of our loving God.

john316
12-04-2005, 06:28 AM
Here is the latest from PETA.It is a comic book called your "Daddy Kills Animals" and it tells kids to watch their puppies and kittens because their daddy may kill them.They are passing them out to kids in some schools.

From what i see they dont know the difference between a animal and a fish ::]

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y121/jmi1960/0_24_112205_peta.jpg

bob
12-04-2005, 10:32 AM
Wow, that's a really stupid comic book . . . and what's wrong with eating Pets? :P





I'm joking, if anyone didn't notice . . .

Isildur9473
12-04-2005, 10:57 AM
PETA are a bunch of new age fanatics. Why doesn't anyone start a group to speak out against the evils of PETA? We could be called APETA. Anti - People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals. We could pass out comic books talking about how horrible they are in schools.

bob
12-04-2005, 06:10 PM
PETA are a bunch of new age fanatics. Why doesn't anyone start a group to speak out against the evils of PETA? We could be called APETA. Anti - People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals. We could pass out comic books talking about how horrible they are in schools.

We could just make another group named PETA, People for the Eating of Tasty Animals

Isildur9473
12-04-2005, 07:05 PM
more importantly, i'd like to see a human never purposefully cause harm to another human.

dolphins are amazing. and they can communicate in ways we can't even understand. almost a sixth sense sort of way (they understand the needs of the people in the tank, so they can react to them accordingly). let's see you do that, Mr. Greg. ;)

Thank you all for dismissing my point in an attempt to be wity. I applaud you.

unshakeable15
12-05-2005, 12:51 PM
you're welcome. :) i try. ;)


and Skilletosis, go back and read my post. i say nothing about going one way or another on the rights of animals. it's just a diatribe for the amazing creature the dolphin. :)

Isildur9473
12-05-2005, 01:37 PM
you're welcome. :) i try. ;)

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