alienyouth9292
12-15-2006, 02:02 PM
You can disagree with me, but i am sick of all the political correctness "Happy Holidays" crap in the USA. It is Christmas!!! You should have the right to put a tree up in public, sing Christmas carols, and say "Merry Christmas". America is becoming full of God-hating liberals who do give a dang about other false religions.....what do you all think?

skynes
12-15-2006, 03:47 PM
I think Political Correctness should be burned and we should all urinate on the ashes.

that about sums it up.

riz
12-15-2006, 09:04 PM
1. I like how you group liberals under the term "God-hating" when that isn't always the case.

2. I wouldn't do away with all forms of political correctness; that's a tad bit extreme. It doesn't have to horribly go overboard, though.

3. Why does there ALWAYS have to be a thread on this during the holidays? Use the search function, please.

DarkestRose
12-15-2006, 10:52 PM
I don't really like how Christmas is becoming politicized. I mean, I love Christmas. I love celebrating the birth of Jesus, remembering God's redemptive heart through Him. Ornamented Christmas trees. Lavishly decorated and lit-up houses. Christmas carols about our Savior’s birth. Nativity scenes. I love the magical, biasedly Christmas aspects of the season. This is my favorite holiday. I'm all for trees and carols and "Merry Christmas" greetings.

I have no problem with Jews wanting to be able to publicly display Hanukkah festivities with us though. I mean, if it makes them feel included and it displays Christ's love to them, why not?

I think political correcness isn't all bad either. When it's completely over-the-top and used to put minorites over everyone else, then it's ridiculous. But I've no problem with giving respect, dignity and sensitivity to people.

Also, liberals can be Christian too. I don't know if there is one "Christian politial party." Just because Christians tend to conglomerate toward the conservative side, doesn't mean that liberal Christians are "less Christian" or anything like that. They're doing what they believe God wants them to do as far as politics goes.

alienyouth9292
12-16-2006, 09:08 AM
i was just talking about liberals in general. i know that liberals can love Christ too.

skilletosis
12-16-2006, 01:00 PM
Well due to the huge public outcry Walmart got rid of the mandatory "Happy Holidays" greetings they had to use last year and the employees get to say "Merry Christmas" this year. Score 1 for Christmas.

terrasin
12-16-2006, 01:24 PM
I was walking around the stores thinking about Christmas the other day and how it seems the magic of this time of year is fading away. When I was a kid, people really worked at making Christmas, Christmas. Now it just seems like a single decoration in a store is fine. There aren't as many Christmas specials on tv anymore either. It just seems like our culture is starting to let go of it. Maybe I'm just crazy, but it makes me sad.

CJ

Vuren
12-16-2006, 01:51 PM
Well christmas can be celebrated how ever you want to, but when it comes to say the schools it shouldn't be christmas. it should be holidays or winter break, because while the united states is one nation under god, we never said which god and there was a reason for it. when it comes to business' they will always do what makes them the most money.

and as to the comment about liberals being god haters, thanks next time just call us commies, gets the same thing over;)

skynes
12-16-2006, 03:29 PM
All liberals are Commies... lol

Well christmas can be celebrated how ever you want to

Sorry but carols and baby Jesus aren't politically correct. Gonna have to ban all forms of Christianity in December, it's to prevent other groups being offended.

you'll know it'll happen eventually

DarkestRose
12-16-2006, 10:58 PM
All liberals are Commies... lol



Sorry but carols and baby Jesus aren't politically correct. Gonna have to ban all forms of Christianity in December, it's to prevent other groups being offended.

you'll know it'll happen eventually

I keep hearing that, but it doesn’t happen. Christmas stuff doesn’t really get banned where I live. The only thing that’s changed is the giant Christmas tree turned into a Holiday Tree to be a holiday equalizer. But churches can still display mangers and Christmas stuff.

skilletfreak101
12-17-2006, 12:07 PM
3. Why does there ALWAYS have to be a thread on this during the holidays?

haha you just said during the holidays..quit being politically correct!

alienyouth9292
12-17-2006, 12:37 PM
haha you just said during the holidays..quit being politically correct!



hahahaha!!!! i had read an article on the web about it and it sparked my interest....this is not just about Christmas. politcal correctness occurs 365 days a year.

by the way, i don't see how you all can agree with it. how is it good???

terrasin
12-17-2006, 04:02 PM
while the united states is one nation under god, we never said which god and there was a reason for it.
It was quite clear which God they were talking about back when it was written. They didn't have all this political correctness crap we have today when it was written.

CJ

alienyouth9292
12-17-2006, 04:08 PM
back then it was unheard of to follow false gods in the usa. while many politicians were deists, they still knew the GOD.

skilletfreak101
12-17-2006, 06:29 PM
It was quite clear which God they were talking about back when it was written. They didn't have all this political correctness crap we have today when it was written.

CJ
agreed. today's politicalness sickens me

DarkestRose
12-18-2006, 09:02 AM
I don’t see political correctness as all wrong. It has both positives and negatives.

For example, there are certain racial epithets we don’t use because they are rude and insensitive to people of other races. It’s the same with of different minorities and “identity groups.” If it seems that a certain phrase will needlessly offend, it’s better to just avoid it. I think it helps people think consciously about how they describe certain people and it helps avoid negative stereotypes. In that sense, I think that politically correct jargon can have its merits.

The negative is that it can be taken too far. Some people are over sensitive and will pick part your choice of whether you referred to them as “black” or “African-American” and which one is least offensive. The gender-neutral terminology is also frustrating, like, for example, I had a writing teacher that wouldn’t allow the phrase “mankind” to be graded as correct because it was sexist. I found this annoying because I’m a chick and used “mankind” over “humankind” because it was less cumbersome and the latter phrase was superfluously PC. I think people who play PC police over everything have taken it too far, just like anything good can be taken too far and perverted from original intent. I think those people also are the reason PC jargon can be so fun to parody.

planet_kosmos
12-18-2006, 03:33 PM
I don't see the point of christmas trees, what relevance do they have to anything, what do they have to do with christmas? I just sorta wish sometimes that someone would see Santa and yell Heresy as loud as they could. Thats my $0.02

terrasin
12-18-2006, 04:07 PM
Why? Santa Claus is a Christian figure.

CJ

skilletfreak101
12-18-2006, 05:18 PM
I don't see the point of christmas trees, what relevance do they have to anything, what do they have to do with christmas? I just sorta wish sometimes that someone would see Santa and yell Heresy as loud as they could. Thats my $0.02
the question is...why not a christmas tree?

Tromos
12-18-2006, 08:01 PM
The gender-neutral terminology is also frustrating


"For God so loved the world that He/She sent His/Her only Son/Daughter so that whosoever should believe in Him/Her shall not perish but have eternal life."


... I'm waiting for it. I just know it's gonna happen ::]

Vuren
12-19-2006, 12:28 AM
agreed. today's politicalness sickens me

and honestly a lot of "christians" sicken me. who cares how you celebrate christmas. why not celebrate christmas in actions? going out helping the needy, taking care of your brothers and sisters instead complaining about how political correctness is abhorent. Honest many many people like myself would be a lot more receptive to chistianity if the people would stop being so arrogant(jimmy swaggert, ted haggert(i believe that's the correct name) and fred phelps. Actions have always spoken louder then words. Christ didn't stand around preaching saying words just to hear himself speak. He went to the outcast of the world at the time, he befriended them, he used his actions to help teach, he used parables to teach. would that not be a better way to celebrate his life? to see a homeless person on the street, wouldn't it be better to help and try to find them something they can use, a hat, a new coat, go buy them a meal and give it to them

skynes
12-19-2006, 03:00 AM
"For God so loved the world that He/She sent His/Her only Son/Daughter so that whosoever should believe in Him/Her shall not perish but have eternal life."


... I'm waiting for it. I just know it's gonna happen ::]

there is one that exists that replaces He with One in an effort to make God gender neutral. Can't for the love of me remember its name

Tromos
12-19-2006, 05:14 AM
and honestly a lot of "christians" sicken me. who cares how you celebrate christmas. why not celebrate christmas in actions? going out helping the needy, taking care of your brothers and sisters instead complaining about how political correctness is abhorent. Honest many many people like myself would be a lot more receptive to chistianity if the people would stop being so arrogant . . .Actions have always spoken louder then words. Christ didn't stand around preaching saying words just to hear himself speak. He went to the outcast of the world at the time, he befriended them, he used his actions to help teach, he used parables to teach. would that not be a better way to celebrate his life? to see a homeless person on the street, wouldn't it be better to help and try to find them something they can use, a hat, a new coat, go buy them a meal and give it to them


Touché.

Some do this. Most don't. And few that do have the proper attitude. I'm at least as guilty as anyone else.

Thanks for the reminder. Obviously the PC "heathens" aren't the only ones who get self-absorbed this time of year :-[

skilletfreak101
12-19-2006, 08:37 AM
and honestly a lot of "christians" sicken me. who cares how you celebrate christmas. why not celebrate christmas in actions? going out helping the needy, taking care of your brothers and sisters instead complaining about how political correctness is abhorent. Honest many many people like myself would be a lot more receptive to chistianity if the people would stop being so arrogant(jimmy swaggert, ted haggert(i believe that's the correct name) and fred phelps. Actions have always spoken louder then words. Christ didn't stand around preaching saying words just to hear himself speak. He went to the outcast of the world at the time, he befriended them, he used his actions to help teach, he used parables to teach. would that not be a better way to celebrate his life? to see a homeless person on the street, wouldn't it be better to help and try to find them something they can use, a hat, a new coat, go buy them a meal and give it to them
i agree completely...i still don't like political correctness...but part of that is alot of today's christians fault for not being the "salt of the earth" and i'm also guilty of that :-(

alienyouth9292
12-19-2006, 09:17 AM
i can't stand those PC gender-neutral bibles. i hate 'em. By the way, they are called TNIV bibles. Loads of crap...

skilletfreak101
12-19-2006, 11:26 AM
i can't stand those PC gender-neutral bibles. i hate 'em. By the way, they are called TNIV bibles. Loads of crap...
omg they are actually real??? STUUUUUUUUPIIIIIIDD!!!!!!!!!

riz
12-19-2006, 07:13 PM
haha you just said during the holidays..quit being politically correct!

::]



I'm sorry. I forgot that when I type something out, I have to look it over to make sure I'm not being politically correct.

(A big ol' high-five to Vuren for his statement. Wonderfully put.)

terrasin
12-19-2006, 10:37 PM
I don't see the point of christmas trees, what relevance do they have to anything, what do they have to do with christmas?
Oh, and the tree thing was actually started by Druids who would hang a tree upside down to ward off evil spirits.

CJ

planet_kosmos
12-20-2006, 12:06 AM
Oh, and the tree thing was actually started by Druids who would hang a tree upside down to ward off evil spirits.

CJ

Ok thanks CJ, it sounds a bit pagan to me.

riz
12-20-2006, 07:31 AM
Druids? What? I'd never heard of this theory of the origin of the Christmas tree - or the fact that they hung it upside down. I always read about the custom beginning in Germany in 15th or 16th century.

terrasin
12-20-2006, 07:39 AM
Meh, it's part of our tradition now reguardless of the origin. There is really no proof that our christmas tradition came from the druids tradition.

CJ

skynes
12-20-2006, 08:40 AM
Oh, and the tree thing was actually started by Druids who would hang a tree upside down to ward off evil spirits.

CJ

Oh? I thought it was a tree to celebrate pagan gods of life and rebirth etc. all involving the sacrfice of a turkey, lots of gift giving and partying.

terrasin
12-20-2006, 09:18 AM
That's a common misconception, but even then, there is no proof that what we do now came from a pagan tradition. There is not even proof that it was a pagan tradition. However, we do know that Druids used trees.

CJ

NightCrawler
12-21-2006, 07:03 PM
The other day, I heard an ad on the radio that went kinda like this:
"I know it isn't politically correct, but I want to celebrate Christ's birth. Merry Christmas to everyone, from [something something] Lumber!"

DarkestRose
12-21-2006, 07:24 PM
The other day, I heard an ad on the radio that went kinda like this:
"I know it isn't politically correct, but I want to celebrate Christ's birth. Merry Christmas to everyone, from [something something] Lumber!"

That's sweet. I like that.

Don't see why saying happy birthday to Jesus isn't PC. I mean, I'm not offended when someone else celebrates Hanukah.

NightCrawler
12-23-2006, 09:38 AM
That's sweet. I like that.

Don't see why saying happy birthday to Jesus isn't PC. I mean, I'm not offended when someone else celebrates Hanukah.
There is nothing wrong with celebrating. All they want to do with PC is to avoid offending someone. What if someone wished you Happy Hanukah? Kawanzaa? You don't celebrate those. Now, what if you believed strongly that the celebration was countering your religion? Celebrating Christ's birth is in direct conflict with Judiasm. If I wish a Jewish man Merry Christmas, he might be offended.

Thus the PC "Happy Holidays!"

DarkestRose
12-23-2006, 09:46 AM
There is nothing wrong with celebrating. All they want to do with PC is to avoid offending someone. What if someone wished you Happy Hanukah? Kawanzaa? You don't celebrate those. Now, what if you believed strongly that the celebration was countering your religion? Celebrating Christ's birth is in direct conflict with Judiasm. If I wish a Jewish man Merry Christmas, he might be offended.

Thus the PC "Happy Holidays!"

Well, I have a friend who wishes me a Happy Winter Solstice, and that kinda conflicts with me because it's on the New Age side of things. I know her deep-down intent is to wish me well, so even though it's a bit awkward, I'm not offended. I just wish her a Merry Christmas back.

Tromos
12-23-2006, 03:15 PM
Celebrating Christ's birth is in direct conflict with Judiasm.

Actually, Christ's birth is the ultimate culmination of Judaism and proof of the validity of the OT . . . most of them just don't recognize it ;)

NightCrawler
12-24-2006, 02:44 PM
Actually, Christ's birth is the ultimate culmination of Judaism and proof of the validity of the OT . . . most of them just don't recognize it ;)

Nope. Anyone who denies the Son denies the Father. They either a) Are not into Judaism as you have defined it or b) They are practicing Judaism and your definition is wrong.

Tromos
12-24-2006, 05:52 PM
The point I was trying to make is that Jesus came primarily as Messiah to the Jews. He fulfilled everything their prophecies told them to expect. Had the Jews paid attention to what Judaism taught, they would have realized that Jesus was what they were looking for. Some did. But notice that, unless you believe "extended" Scripture (e.g., the Book of Mormon), Jesus preached almost exclusively to the Jews. He came to offer them salvation by fulfilling the Law that they could not. When the invited guests rejected the feast, it was offered to the rest of us.

And while non-Jews are not bound by the Law, there is nothing wrong with following Jewish customs and recognizing Jesus as the Messiah at the same time. That's what all the disciples did. Jesus Himself was a Jew and perfectly followed the Jewish laws. This was, in fact, the first Christian crisis: must followers of Jesus also follow Jewish laws and customs? Peter said Yes. Paul said No. Thus we get the famous quotes from Paul about freedom from the Law, etc etc. Eventually Peter came to agree with Paul. But the majority of early (1st century) Christians were also practicing Jews. Do you deny their salvation because they didn't throw away the Jewish customs and live like you think they should? I hope not.

There's a difference between being freed from the Law and having an obligation to disregard the Law. While we may be freed from the Law and while salvation no longer comes through the Law, observance of the Law is not sin. Note the man who came to Jesus and asked what he must do to be saved. Jesus praised the man for his scrupulous observance of the Law, yet the man lacked the dedication of his heart because his heart was too wrapped up in his money and possessions.

There seem to be a lot of people that assume all Jews will be condemned and that a Jew cannot recognize Jesus as the Christ. I think those are the folks who just want to keep Jesus as their private little Savior and are looking for reasons to justify their already anti-semitic tendencies.

skynes
12-25-2006, 01:13 AM
I prefer to call it the Old Covenant myself. Cause Judaism and the Old covenant were quite different in Jesus' day (courtesy of the Pharisees) and are quite different today (cause the Old Covenant has been abolished yet they still practice it.)

Jesus was the fulfillment of the promises of the old Covenant.

alienyouth9292
12-25-2006, 06:53 PM
to this day i don't know why the Jews rejected everything about Jesus. He was everything that they had prophecied about in the OT....man, we're getting way off subject. i'm just glad that today went well and without any PC that i knew of.

*hears tv in background saying "hundreds of Jews attack giant Christmas tree in new york with many carolers getting trampled"*

jk, lol

DarkestRose
12-25-2006, 07:02 PM
to this day i don't know why the Jews rejected everything about Jesus. He was everything that they had prophecied about in the OT....man, we're getting way off subject. i'm just glad that today went well and without any PC that i knew of.

*hears tv in background saying "hundreds of Jews attack giant Christmas tree in new york with many carolers getting trampled"*

jk, lol

Um...why are we still so down on the Jews?

It's not all Jews who reject Jesus. What about Messianic Jews? ::]They would be Christian, but may still practice some Jewish traditions. They may even celebrate both Christmas and Hanukkah, maybe even wanting the menorah to be acknowledged in all the winter festivities.

skynes
12-26-2006, 08:32 AM
to this day i don't know why the Jews rejected everything about Jesus. He was everything that they had prophecied about in the OT....man, we're getting way off subject. i'm just glad that today went well and without any PC that i knew of.

They wanted a Warlord Messiah that would physically bring a kingdom of God on earth and beat the Romans silly. Instead they got a humble carpenter who preached peace and forgiveness.

Um...why are we still so down on the Jews?

It's not all Jews who reject Jesus. What about Messianic Jews?

Jew is Jew, Messianic Jew is Messianic Jew. When I say Jew I mean Jew, when I say Messianic Jew I mean Messianic Jew.

Jew's reject Christ, Messianic Jews accept Him.

DarkestRose
12-26-2006, 11:33 AM
Jew is Jew, Messianic Jew is Messianic Jew. When I say Jew I mean Jew, when I say Messianic Jew I mean Messianic Jew.

Jew's reject Christ, Messianic Jews accept Him.

But they're still Jewish. Being a Messianic Jew doesn't make one less Jewish.

skynes
12-26-2006, 01:08 PM
But they're still Jewish. Being a Messianic Jew doesn't make one less Jewish.

My point was that when I talk about Jews in a modern sense I'm referring to those Jews who reject Christ as the Messiah. If I'm referring to those who've accepted Christ I call them Messianic.

It gets confusing cause Jew is not a religion any more but a cultural identity.

So religiously speaking, a Messianic Jew is Jew by culture, but Christian by Faith.

DarkestRose
12-26-2006, 01:33 PM
My point was that when I talk about Jews in a modern sense I'm referring to those Jews who reject Christ as the Messiah. If I'm referring to those who've accepted Christ I call them Messianic.

It gets confusing cause Jew is not a religion any more but a cultural identity.

So religiously speaking, a Messianic Jew is Jew by culture, but Christian by Faith.

I get that. I was just thinking that when people post a very general "Jews deny Christ" that may not be true in terms of cultural identity.

skilletosis
12-27-2006, 08:54 AM
I for one am so glad that we're no longer getting the sale commercials shoved down our throats anymore. Man they are horrible. They absolutely are written to try and make you feel that if you don't give that perfect expensive gift that you are a failure. I use the tivo for everything except the news just so I can skip commercials.

kittygirl
12-27-2006, 05:16 PM
But they're still Jewish. Being a Messianic Jew doesn't make one less Jewish.

Paul was a Messianic Jew. If you want proof, check in Phillipians.

as~i~lay~dying
12-27-2006, 08:08 PM
Yes, it irritates me tremendously how everyone is so dang sensitive. Wouldnt it be wonderful if people would just loosen up?

Tromos
12-27-2006, 08:32 PM
to this day i don't know why the Jews rejected everything about Jesus. He was everything that they had prophecied about in the OT


Warning - long post


Step back and think about it from the point of view of a 1st century Jew...

In Matthew, John the Baptist calls the Jews to repentance and threatens them with the "wrath of God". Jesus, too, talks about the "wrath of God" in the 4th chapter of John. John the Baptist was speaking directly to the Jewish leadership when he made his comment.

Now think. What would the wrath of God be to them? These are the people who endured slavery to the Egyptians and to the Assyrians. If this was not the wrath of God, then what could be? What could God possibly threaten the Hebrews with that he hadn't already inflicted?

The answer was the bedrock of their lives. The one thing that they all took for granted. The one thing that defined everything they were and without which everything was meaningless. They had failed to give glory and eucharist to God because they had dedicated themselves instead to the Law. The leaders of the nation of Israel had stopped seeing the Law as a path to God and had instead replaced God with the Law. They had begun to worship the Law and since they (particularly the Pharisees) were the representatives of the Law to the average Jewish person, the glory given to the Law was really glory given to them.

So the wrath of God, as called for by John the Baptist and Jesus, seem like veiled threats against the very basis of the Jewish life. The core of the Jewish existence was the Covenant. The assurance that they, and they alone, were God's people. That the eternity of heaven was reserved for them only. The wrath of God was the very thing that shook the very paradigm of their existence.

God was altering the Covenant.

And not just altering. Obliterating. The definition of their existence was that the Law was life. In fact, the Law was LIFE - eternal life. Then Jesus comes and changes all the rules. 2000 years of Law gone with the statement "No one can come to the Father except through Me." I cannot think of a single thing that would have been more abhorrent, more blasphemous to the Jewish community than this alteration - adulteration - of the covenant of Moses.

We think of the wrath of God in terms of physical suffering. Torture or fire or persecution. Even nuclear war. But what if the threat was that everything we believed about God and our salvation was turned on its head and, in the space of 3 years, completely rendered obsolete? The Kingdom was no longer theirs alone. It was open to everyone. And worse, if they didn't completely modify everything they believed to recognize the change they would get none of the inheritance and be left with no part of the Promise. The choice: Deny everything in which you've ever believed that defined your life or be forever denied the company of God.

Suddenly, the murder of Jesus makes so much more sense. What would I do to someone who preached and represented the death of my faith as I know it? And their words rang with the Truth of the Word?

alienyouth9292
12-28-2006, 06:50 AM
good, uh..., point. they didn't understand Jesus or John the baptist at all.

this thread is getting deep...!

skynes
12-28-2006, 10:03 AM
I get that. I was just thinking that when people post a very general "Jews deny Christ" that may not be true in terms of cultural identity.

The line gets blurred because Jew means a faith and a culture at once.

Step back and think about it from the point of view of a 1st century Jew...

Dude... that post rocks. Thanks for that.

unshakeable15
12-30-2006, 08:00 PM
Not trying to get off topic here, but it's already there, so might as well jump in headfirst.

If Jesus came to destroy the law, then why do we keep the Old Testament as part of our Bibles? A history lesson?

Matthew 5:17-18 (http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Matthew%205:17-18;&version=31;) "Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished."

Tromos
12-31-2006, 01:01 PM
Jesus didn't come to destroy the Law, He came to fulfill it.

But the path to salvation is no longer through the Law. There is a new Covenant. Salvation now comes only through Christ Jesus.

skynes
12-31-2006, 01:36 PM
Jesus didn't come to destroy the Law, He came to fulfill it.

But the path to salvation is no longer through the Law. There is a new Covenant. Salvation now comes only through Christ Jesus.

I don't think the Law was ever intended to be a path to salvation. I think that as Paul said, the Law is there to expose sin.

It was to show the people that they were sinners and needed a propitiation for their sins.

But humans as they are like to overcomplicate things, so they went and took the law and made it a path themselves...

If Jesus came to destroy the law, then why do we keep the Old Testament as part of our Bibles? A history lesson?

There are some Bibles which you get for free that are only the Psalms and and the NT. This is cause the group behind it don't believe anything in the OT, that it was all abolished in Christ. So there are some who take your point to practical extremes.

(Sorry I can't remember the name of the group, I thought it was the Gideons, but after research I found they do have full Bibles, they just put them into hospitals and hotels etc.)

NightCrawler
01-01-2007, 11:28 AM
I don't think the Law was ever intended to be a path to salvation. I think that as Paul said, the Law is there to expose sin.

It was to show the people that they were sinners and needed a propitiation for their sins.

But humans as they are like to overcomplicate things, so they went and took the law and made it a path themselves...
That's what I thought. Abraham believed God and it was credited him as righteousness.

There are some Bibles which you get for free that are only the Psalms and and the NT. This is cause the group behind it don't believe anything in the OT, that it was all abolished in Christ. So there are some who take your point to practical extremes.

(Sorry I can't remember the name of the group, I thought it was the Gideons, but after research I found they do have full Bibles, they just put them into hospitals and hotels etc.)
Gideons do give out NKJV bibles that have the NT, Psalms and Proverbs. However, I never heard it was because they didn't believe the OT was beneficial anymore.

skynes
01-01-2007, 12:20 PM
Gideons do give out NKJV bibles that have the NT, Psalms and Proverbs. However, I never heard it was because they didn't believe the OT was beneficial anymore.

There is one group that believes that, I thought it was the Gideons cause they're the only ones I know who hand out half-Bibles. But they do have full versions too so it must have been another group.

Tromos
01-03-2007, 04:14 AM
I don't think the Law was ever intended to be a path to salvation. I think that as Paul said, the Law is there to expose sin.

It was all the Hebrews had until Jesus came. They had no other path to salvation except the Law.

Unfortunately what they failed to recognize was that the purpose of the Law was to point them to the true foundations of life in God: love of God and love of each other. Most seemed to focus on the Law for the sake of the Law instead of recognizing the purpose for the Law.

So, I guess I'm not sure what was available as a path for salvation for those who worshipped God before Jesus came. Perhaps that's why the Catholic church believes that all the righteous people were trapped in hell until Jesus died and freed them. Which seems odd to me, I guess, because that imparts a time restriction on the afterlife.

*shrug* No idea.

skynes
01-03-2007, 04:30 AM
It was all the Hebrews had until Jesus came. They had no other path to salvation except the Law.

Unfortunately what they failed to recognize was that the purpose of the Law was to point them to the true foundations of life in God: love of God and love of each other. Most seemed to focus on the Law for the sake of the Law instead of recognizing the purpose for the Law.

So, I guess I'm not sure what was available as a path for salvation for those who worshipped God before Jesus came. Perhaps that's why the Catholic church believes that all the righteous people were trapped in hell until Jesus died and freed them. Which seems odd to me, I guess, because that imparts a time restriction on the afterlife.

*shrug* No idea.

Read Romans! Paul covers it all. God had the exact same way of giving salvation as He does now. Faith in Him and nothing else. "Abraham believed God and it was accounted to him for righteousness."

He says that the purpose of the law was to show where sin was. He says that the Commandment of love your neighbour as yourself was all of the laws condensed into one, not a new law to override the others.

God's method of salvation has always been Faith.

Now it's Faith in Christ for what He has done.

Then it was Faith in God for what He would soon do.

Unregistered
01-03-2007, 07:39 AM
"For God so loved the world that He/She sent His/Her only Son/Daughter so that whosoever should believe in Him/Her shall not perish but have eternal life."


... I'm waiting for it. I just know it's gonna happen ::]

this better not happen.this phrase disturbs and scares me.

Unregistered
01-03-2007, 07:42 AM
i can't stand those PC gender-neutral bibles. i hate 'em. By the way, they are called TNIV bibles. Loads of crap...


yea,i hate them too.i mean,Jesus was a "man",and he was God's "Son",not daughter.

bubblesemm
01-03-2007, 08:02 AM
well,those Bibles that claim that Jesus and God are "its" scare/disturb me. i dispise them. in my opinion they go completely against Christianity. i mean,the Bible even says that Jesus was the "Son" of God not the daughter,and that God was Jesus' father.(Jesus even says in the Bible that "he" only did what "he" saw the "father" doing.)

bubblesemm
01-03-2007, 08:05 AM
I agree with whoever it was that said that people are too sensitive.i mean,people should really loosen up.and what really gets me is that we are so "we don't care" whenever it comes to a lot of things,but when it comes to religious matters/deep matters,we all freak out.(i like this thread.it was a good topic)

DarkestRose
01-03-2007, 08:33 AM
I actually don't feel that people are "too sensitive." I think society is becoming too apathetic to the needs and feelings of other people.

First of all, I don't see why it is wrong to care about deep matters. These are the matters closest to our hearts and therefore the things we protect dearly. Christians are also guilty of becoming offended over every petty offense.

But who would call a person of a minority race “too sensitive” for battling racism? Who could call a family member of a mentally ill person “too sensitive” for fighting the stigmas associated with that illness? Some people shouldn’t be so easily dismissed until they are understood.

The heart of the PC-movement is simply that people want to feel respected, dignified, accepted and included. When people “freak out” it is because they feel that sense of worth and understanding is being taken from them, that what is important to them is being ridiculed. PC language doesn’t have to be a rules-and-regulations code of conduct between people. It can simply be love and compassion toward others who need it, who are different from us and feel like they are on the outside looking in.

As an afterthought, I think that people use the "they're too over sensitive" line to excuse themselves from any moral responsibility concerning compassion, examining the way that they treat others.

bubblesemm
01-03-2007, 10:21 AM
no,i wasn't trying to justify being mean to other people,but you have to admit that people sometimes just need to let things go instead of making a big deal about it.i am guilty of doing that too.

DarkestRose
01-03-2007, 11:31 AM
Practically speaking, yes, it does do better to let things go. It's best to just forgive offenses, pray that God will give a heart of grace and mercy, and just be the one to be the peacemaker. I think if everybody did that, we would have an greater peace with each other.

The problem is that we're all emotional beings (some more emotional than others) and because of the Fall, we're all broken. In Eden, Adam and Eve felt secure because they were connected to God and recieved all their acceptance from God. But now we all have a funadmental brokenness to ourselves that constantly looks to others for affirmation. So, I think people demand justice and a vindication of their pride as a form of self-redemption. It doesn't work but it's comprehensible.

And I think after hearing the same stigma or whatever applied to oneself, it become harder to let go of everything. It feels like people rubbing salt in the wound.

I think it boils to that some people are very sensitive, but a "get over it" approach is insensitve.

alienyouth9292
01-03-2007, 12:59 PM
Practically speaking, yes, it does do better to let things go. It's best to just forgive offenses, pray that God will give a heart of grace and mercy, and just be the one to be the peacemaker. I think if everybody did that, we would have an greater peace with each other.

The problem is that we're all emotional beings (some more emotional than others) and because of the Fall, we're all broken. In Eden, Adam and Eve felt secure because they were connected to God and recieved all their acceptance from God. But now we all have a funadmental brokenness to ourselves that constantly looks to others for affirmation. So, I think people demand justice and a vindication of their pride as a form of self-redemption. It doesn't work but it's comprehensible.

And I think after hearing the same stigma or whatever applied to oneself, it become harder to let go of everything. It feels like people rubbing salt in the wound.

I think it boils to that some people are very sensitive, but a "get over it" approach is insensitve.


well, some people have to "get over it" or they will forever cry in their corner about something "mean" they heard.:o i know that that may not be politically correct but too bad!! people are too sensitive and will whine just to get attension.


my rant is over....::] ;D

DarkestRose
01-03-2007, 04:12 PM
well, some people have to "get over it" or they will forever cry in their corner about something "mean" they heard.:o i know that that may not be politically correct but too bad!! people are too sensitive and will whine just to get attension.


my rant is over....::] ;D

The problem I have with that response it that there is a complete lack of compassion. People don't heal because someone admonishes them for being hurt and this was never something that Jesus did to people. When He met suffering people, He didn't say, "Get over it." God is compassionate toward those who are persecuted.

People need someone to be a counselor and a healer, someone who will be their champion and their advocate. The sad thing is that the world practices compassionate sensitivity to people far more often than Christians seem to.

skynes
01-04-2007, 04:11 AM
The problem I have with that response it that there is a complete lack of compassion. People don't heal because someone admonishes them for being hurt and this was never something that Jesus did to people. When He met suffering people, He didn't say, "Get over it." God is compassionate toward those who are persecuted.

People need someone to be a counselor and a healer, someone who will be their champion and their advocate. The sad thing is that the world practices compassionate sensitivity to people far more often than Christians seem to.

Actually I can think of one time in scripture where God turned to Elijah and essentially said "Suck it up and deal with it." when he was depressed.

I think what Alienyouth was saying is that a lot of the PC going around has nothing to do with compassion, but whiney little brats who want their way. Best way to deal with whiney brats is a spanking and bed with no dinner, lol. (of course spanking isn't PC anymore is it?)

alienyouth9292
01-04-2007, 04:19 AM
Actually I can think of one time in scripture where God turned to Elijah and essentially said "Suck it up and deal with it." when he was depressed.

I think what Alienyouth was saying is that a lot of the PC going around has nothing to do with compassion, but whiney little brats who want their way. Best way to deal with whiney brats is a spanking and bed with no dinner, lol. (of course spanking isn't PC anymore is it?)


well done, scott:)

Tromos
01-04-2007, 05:18 AM
Best way to deal with whiney brats is a spanking and bed with no dinner, lol. (of course spanking isn't PC anymore is it?)

Truly spoken like a man without a daughter.

Don't say I didn't warn you ;D

bubblesemm
01-04-2007, 07:09 AM
i can see where you are coming from Jennifer,but you have to see where we are coming from too.(not trying to sound rude).i think that it all depends on the person and also i think that our answer to this problem lies in between the two sides.we need to have a little both points of view.

skynes
01-04-2007, 10:31 AM
Truly spoken like a man without a daughter.

Don't say I didn't warn you ;D

Lol, yup. No daughter here. I suppose I'll find out what the right thing to say is when I do have one huh?

Tromos
01-04-2007, 10:34 AM
Lol, yup. No daughter here. I suppose I'll find out what the right thing to say is when I do have one huh?

If it makes you feel better to think so, go right ahead. But daughters are female, so no matter what you say it will be wrong :D

*runs from Weebird*

DarkestRose
01-04-2007, 11:39 AM
Actually I can think of one time in scripture where God turned to Elijah and essentially said "Suck it up and deal with it." when he was depressed.

I don't think God had a blatantly "suck it up" attitude. I read that moment as being very sympathetic. Elijah was kinda having a break down and, the first and second times, God sent an angel who told him, "Arise and eat," and the angel had a cake and water. Then God asks Elijah what he's doing and Elijah starts complaining about hard everything is. And God comes in a still, small voice and tells him that He has a plan, that He's gotta keep going. No, God didn't go, "oh, poor you, poor Elijah!" but I don't think He was all "get over it already!" either.

But anyway, my point isn't professional victims. There may always be someone who is going to sell bestseller after bestseller about how oppressed their identity group is without really wanting to solve anything.

My original point was about the Christmas subject on the area of political correctness. I am all for celebrating Christmas for the sake of celebrating Christ's birth and I do not want anybody to say that I cannot personally celebrate it. Nobody has. But when a Jewish person wants a Menorah included or people change to "happy holidays" so that everybody feels included, I don't have a problem with that. The "Christmas only" people sometimes have a habit of forcibly and openly excluding people in Jesus' name. That bothers me.

The only other thing that really bothered me was that people would rather tell someone who feels offended "get over it" and I honestly cannot see why. If someone is honestly hurt (not meaning pro victims) then I think we would need to re-evaluate how we treat other people. It's easier to shake ones head and say, "they're having some pity party," than it is to attempt to fully understand a person and see from their perspective.

alienyouth9292
01-04-2007, 11:55 AM
I don't think God had a blatantly "suck it up" attitude. I read that moment as being very sympathetic. Elijah was kinda having a break down and, the first and second times, God sent an angel who told him, "Arise and eat," and the angel had a cake and water. Then God asks Elijah what he's doing and Elijah starts complaining about hard everything is. And God comes in a still, small voice and tells him that He has a plan, that He's gotta keep going. No, God didn't go, "oh, poor you, poor Elijah!" but I don't think He was all "get over it already!" either.

But anyway, my point isn't professional victims. There may always be someone who is going to sell bestseller after bestseller about how oppressed their identity group is without really wanting to solve anything.

My original point was about the Christmas subject on the area of political correctness. I am all for celebrating Christmas for the sake of celebrating Christ's birth and I do not want anybody to say that I cannot personally celebrate it. Nobody has. But when a Jewish person wants a Menorah included or people change to "happy holidays" so that everybody feels included, I don't have a problem with that. The "Christmas only" people sometimes have a habit of forcibly and openly excluding people in Jesus' name. That bothers me.

The only other thing that really bothered me was that people would rather tell someone who feels offended "get over it" and I honestly cannot see why. If someone is honestly hurt (not meaning pro victims) then I think we would need to re-evaluate who we treat other people. It's easier to shake ones head and say, "they're having some pity party," than it is to attempt to fully understand a person and see from their perspective.


God came in a still, small voice?? i seriously doubt that God did that.:-\

i understand that you have to have some compassion for others, but it will be useless if you come at them like a weak little rabbit....;D

DarkestRose
01-04-2007, 12:09 PM
God came in a still, small voice?? i seriously doubt that God did that.:-\

i understand that you have to have some compassion for others, but it will be useless if you come at them like a weak little rabbit....;D

God did come in a still small voice. "And behold, the LORD passed by, and a great and strong wind tore into the mountains and broke the rocks in pieces before the LORD, but the LORD was not in the wind; and after the wind an earthquake, but the LORD was not in the earthquake; and after the earthwuake a fire, but the LORD was not in the fire; and after the fire a small voice. So it was, when Elijah heard it, that he wrapped his face in his mantle and went out and stood int he entrance of the cave." 1 Kings 19:11-13 That was how God appeared to Elijah.

Also compassion is not weak. God is full of compassion, especially that He might have compassion on dysfunctional sinners who went against Him, that might die to save them and carry their iniquity. It is compassion that caused the father of the prodigal son to run and embrace him after his son. That compassion is strong and bold and needed. The same measure of compassion we want, we should bestow upon others. Christians should love as passionately as we hope to receive from God simply for the sake that God is love. And because the second greatest commandment is to love thy neighbor as you love thy self.

weebird20
01-04-2007, 01:00 PM
If it makes you feel better to think so, go right ahead. But daughters are female, so no matter what you say it will be wrong :D

*runs from Weebird*

*points flamethrower in Tromos' direction* :evil:



or people change to "happy holidays" so that everybody feels included

Jennifer can i ask how changing Happy Christmas to happy Holidays...will make people feel more included?

...is the point of Christmas not to celebrate the birth of Jesus? thats why its named 'Christ'mas...

im not being picky...i would just like to know what you think...i agree with a lot of what you have mentioned so far about us needing to be more compassionate...

Tromos
01-04-2007, 01:01 PM
Honestly, Jennifer, I'm impressed. And convinced.

I can't speak for the rest of these folks, but you've certainly made me take another look at PC-speak.

Absolutely everything in our lives is about love. And this is part of it.

Thank you.

skynes
01-04-2007, 01:20 PM
I don't think God had a blatantly "suck it up" attitude. I read that moment as being very sympathetic. Elijah was kinda having a break down and, the first and second times, God sent an angel who told him, "Arise and eat," and the angel had a cake and water. Then God asks Elijah what he's doing and Elijah starts complaining about hard everything is. And God comes in a still, small voice and tells him that He has a plan, that He's gotta keep going. No, God didn't go, "oh, poor you, poor Elijah!" but I don't think He was all "get over it already!" either.

Wrong moment. It's another one. I can't find it now. It's when God turns to Him when He's depressed and says something like "If you cannot run with the men, how do you expect to keep up with the horses?"

It was a highly sarcastic way of saying "Deal with it, worse is to come."

My original point was about the Christmas subject on the area of political correctness. I am all for celebrating Christmas for the sake of celebrating Christ's birth and I do not want anybody to say that I cannot personally celebrate it. Nobody has. But when a Jewish person wants a Menorah included or people change to "happy holidays" so that everybody feels included, I don't have a problem with that. The "Christmas only" people sometimes have a habit of forcibly and openly excluding people in Jesus' name. That bothers me.

I've yet to met someone who genuinely wanted it to be "happy holidays" to include people. but I've met group after group who want it changed cause they hate Christ.

The only other thing that really bothered me was that people would rather tell someone who feels offended "get over it" and I honestly cannot see why. If someone is honestly hurt (not meaning pro victims) then I think we would need to re-evaluate how we treat other people. It's easier to shake ones head and say, "they're having some pity party," than it is to attempt to fully understand a person and see from their perspective.

Not talking about people who are genuinely offended. You're approach is 100% correct about them.

I'm talking about those who are just whining to get their way.

DarkestRose
01-04-2007, 01:31 PM
Jennifer can i ask how changing Happy Christmas to happy Holidays...will make people feel more included?

...is the point of Christmas not to celebrate the birth of Jesus? thats why its named 'Christ'mas...

im not being picky...i would just like to know what you think...i agree with a lot of what you have mentioned so far about us needing to be more compassionate...

Well, I could rephrase that I don't have anything against anybody stating Merry Christmas. It's just that I feel some sympathy for people who celebrate, say, Hanukkah, and they want to celebrate and be acknowledged as well. And it bothers me when Christians come out and say, "Maybe if you were Christian, you could join in." I want to see these people come to Christ and it worries me that, if Christians always hold this attitude toward them, they might always be dismissive of us because we don't reflect Christ, we reflect our own political beliefs. And if we're not the only ones to celebrate a winter holiday, we shouldn't be claiming a monopoly on it.

DarkestRose
01-04-2007, 01:32 PM
Wrong moment. It's another one. I can't find it now. It's when God turns to Him when He's depressed and says something like "If you cannot run with the men, how do you expect to keep up with the horses?"

It was a highly sarcastic way of saying "Deal with it, worse is to come."


Which part was that in? I believe it's there, just might be nice to be in the same part. ;)

And I know there are moments when people are just being selfish and drowning themselves in self-pity so that people will feel sorry for them. And that would be a moment to speak the truth to them about needing to move on seasoned with grace and love. This might be odd, but when I picture doing that, I imagine the scene in Lord of the Rings after Gandalf has fallen and the hobbits are mourning him and Aragorn says that they need to move on. It's legitimate, what they are upset about, but they gotta keep going. It makes sense to me anyway...

skynes
01-04-2007, 01:34 PM
Which part was that in? I believe it's there, just might be nice to be in the same part. ;)

I honestly can't find it now. Tried all different search criteria but came up nothing... It's in there, I just don't know where right now, lol.

DarkestRose
01-04-2007, 01:41 PM
I honestly can't find it now. Tried all different search criteria but came up nothing... It's in there, I just don't know where right now, lol.

That's cool.

weebird20
01-04-2007, 01:41 PM
I don't know of any Christians that say someone cannot join in the celebrations at Christmas time because they are not also Christian...

...or do you mean that they are leaving people out without realising it because it is seen as a Christian holiday and so non-Christians don't feel part of it?

if its the first...are we to start saying Happy Holidays to people to let them feel more comfortable around us...and so that they will feel more a part of the Christmas celebrations...

DarkestRose
01-04-2007, 01:45 PM
I don't know of any Christians that say someone cannot join in the celebrations at Christmas time because they are not also Christian...

...or do you mean that they are leaving people out without realising it because it is seen as a Christian holiday and so non-Christians don't feel part of it?

if its the first...are we to start saying Happy Holidays to people to let them feel more comfortable around us...and so that they will feel more a part of the Christmas celebrations...

I was meaning more along the lines of people who are Jewish saying they feel kinda out of the loop during Christmastime and how some Christians portray a "that's your fault" attitude.

skynes
01-04-2007, 01:54 PM
Laura found the verse for me.

Jeremiah 12:5

"If you have run with the footmen, and they have wearied you, Then how can you contend with horses? And if in the land of peace, In which you trusted, they wearied you, Then how will you do in the floodplain F6 of the Jordan? "

It was addressed to Jeremiah, not Elijah... my mistake :P

God was telling him that what he's just been through is nothing compared to what the rules of Jerusalem are about to do. In other words: QUIT YOUR WHINING! It gets worse from here!

weebird20
01-04-2007, 01:55 PM
But don't you think that it is the world that puts so much emphasis on the Christmas holidays now?

DarkestRose
01-04-2007, 02:02 PM
But don't you think that it is the world that puts so much emphasis on the Christmas holidays now?

The world does play a huge part in the emphasis of Christmas. Without the world, the holiday definately would not be in the majority that it is. I think this might play into that we are a Western society, not distinctly Jewish, so we don't relate to the celebrations that the Jewish people have. I don't think it is wrong for Christmas to be largely acknowledge. I just think that with Christmas, Hannakah, Kwanza, etc. all happening around the same time, we should't get all bent out of shape when someone posts a "Happy Holidays" versus a "Merry Christmas" sign. We're not the only ones celebrating something.

weebird20
01-04-2007, 02:08 PM
ahhh i get what you mean Jennifer...i agree with that...

alienyouth9292
01-04-2007, 02:48 PM
all i know is that you're not gonna ever see me saying "happy holidays". i will say "merry christmas" and if you're offended, too bad. if you don't like our Christian customs, too bad. i am not condemning you or cursing you, just saying that i was raised in christmas and will forever live in it. i don't want PC whiners ruining our American holiday. i started this thread by thinking that us panheads would agree that all the "happy holidays" crap is well, crap.

don't get me wrong, i am not running my mouth at the other events this time of year. i respect them. what i don't respect is the people who interfere with our Christmas basically because they hate the meaning of our holiday.

skynes
01-04-2007, 02:58 PM
As I heard a Muslim cleric say

"I have heard of noone, Muslim, Buddhist or otherwise take offense at the concept of Christmas. It is Christian hating westerners who are using the minority ethics as an excuse to make an attack on Christianity"

alienyouth9292
01-04-2007, 03:11 PM
?????

DarkestRose
01-04-2007, 03:50 PM
As I heard a Muslim cleric say

"I have heard of noone, Muslim, Buddhist or otherwise take offense at the concept of Christmas. It is Christian hating westerners who are using the minority ethics as an excuse to make an attack on Christianity"

I would agree with that statement.

I'm not really thinking about ignoring Christmas completely. Just acknowleding other people as well.

DarkestRose
01-04-2007, 04:00 PM
all i know is that you're not gonna ever see me saying "happy holidays". i will say "merry christmas" and if you're offended, too bad. if you don't like our Christian customs, too bad. i am not condemning you or cursing you, just saying that i was raised in christmas and will forever live in it. i don't want PC whiners ruining our American holiday. i started this thread by thinking that us panheads would agree that all the "happy holidays" crap is well, crap.

don't get me wrong, i am not running my mouth at the other events this time of year. i respect them. what i don't respect is the people who interfere with our Christmas basically because they hate the meaning of our holiday.

Well, I'm not anti-Christmas. Christmas is what I celebrate. I say "Merry Christmas" to people. I love remembering the birth of Jesus. Part of remembering Jesus is that He was born to die for us, motivated by love and compassion. So the season shouldn't be based solely on religious tradition, but on love. If we care more about tradition than love, we've missed out.

Spiffles
01-04-2007, 04:20 PM
Political Correctness is a good thing. To say otherwsie, (as ive seen in thise thread) is foolish or supports racism, sexism, etc..
Political correctness helps things like being called a nigger or a wog or an abo or something else that is considered offensive by cerntain groups.
Political correctness helps things like equal rights for both male and female.

Some people just take political correctness too far.. It is a problem with people (like many things), not with political correctness..
Political Correctness is perfectly fine.

bubblesemm
01-04-2007, 04:48 PM
i agree with you spiffles.you are sooo right. and i agree with most of what you said too jennifer.

alienyouth9292
01-04-2007, 05:11 PM
i am not a racist, or sexist, and i think that political correctness sucks. it is a weak way for people to make themselves feel good....by saying "look at this! don't you feel sorry for me?"

Tromos
01-04-2007, 05:19 PM
i am not a racist, or sexist, and i think that political correctness sucks. it is a weak way for people to make themselves feel good....by saying "look at this! don't you feel sorry for me?"

As opposed to being a way for you to say "No, because my beliefs are better than yours. So accept my beliefs because yours suck."?

bubblesemm
01-04-2007, 05:26 PM
exactly.

alienyouth9292
01-04-2007, 05:34 PM
No!! Thats not it at all. I don't mean that their beliefs suck....i just mean that i have mine. they have theirs. but i can't stand it when they feel that their beliefs must be accepted when mine are accepted, or else, they whine.

you all have good points. we just think differently...

as~i~lay~dying
01-04-2007, 07:50 PM
Political Correctness is a good thing. To say otherwsie, (as ive seen in thise thread) is foolish or supports racism, sexism, etc..
Political correctness helps things like being called a nigger or a wog or an abo or something else that is considered offensive by cerntain groups.
Political correctness helps things like equal rights for both male and female.

Some people just take political correctness too far.. It is a problem with people (like many things), not with political correctness..
Political Correctness is perfectly fine.

I totally agree.

skynes
01-05-2007, 01:51 AM
You know you're actually talking about different things?

Most are saying: Protecting people is good. Not offending people is good.

Which is all true.

What alienyouth seems to be saying is that people are using Political Correctness to be intolerant of Christians, intolerant of Christmas and intolerant of her. Which, not surprisingly, she's not too happy with.

Using the guise of Tolerance of all, they are being INtolerant of some.

alienyouth9292
01-05-2007, 03:49 AM
i agree scott, but, uh......hahaha, i'm a guy!!

DarkestRose
01-05-2007, 10:25 AM
Well, his first post was stating that he didn't like the "happy holidays" mantra because it should be Christmas only. I disagree with that. Then he went on to ask if we thought that political correctness was crap, and I do not agree in most cases, unless a person is taking it into extreme. Yes, people can use political correctness to make people they disagree with be quiet. That's not the fault of PC, but the problem within the hearts of those people.

skynes
01-05-2007, 12:48 PM
i agree scott, but, uh......hahaha, i'm a guy!!

I'll file that under one character typo, lol. It's my specialty.

unshakeable15
01-05-2007, 02:52 PM
Both sides are agreeing that treating people with compassion and love is better than not. But where the line is drawn in the sand is that the anti-PC side says it's not compassion that causes people to say "Happy Holidays" but intolerance, and the pro-PC folks are saying it's intolerant of US to leave out the other holidays congregating around this time of year (or that time of year, since it's pretty much done and over with).

What about a compromise of saying "Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays?" You can single out Christmas, like you want, but include the other holidays as well.

kittygirl
01-05-2007, 04:38 PM
In a way, I just believe that if people truly didn't care. then they wouldn't make such a big deal about us including Christ.

forceflow17
01-05-2007, 04:44 PM
I will say merry christmas, and if the left wings don't like it the can stuff it!!!

Quadripedman
01-05-2007, 08:36 PM
(talking about gender-neutral Bibles)

omg they are actually real??? STUUUUUUUUPIIIIIIDD!!!!!!!!!


yea. thats like...totally uncool. really, really, really, bad. really bad. depending on how much God gets ticked if you screw with the Bible, those people could be in for...well, a bad burn.

DarkestRose
01-05-2007, 09:08 PM
Both sides are agreeing that treating people with compassion and love is better than not. But where the line is drawn in the sand is that the anti-PC side says it's not compassion that causes people to say "Happy Holidays" but intolerance, and the pro-PC folks are saying it's intolerant of US to leave out the other holidays congregating around this time of year (or that time of year, since it's pretty much done and over with).

What about a compromise of saying "Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays?" You can single out Christmas, like you want, but include the other holidays as well.

Well, I usually just reciprocate whatever greeting is given to me. So if someone says "Merry Christmas," I say it back. Same for "happy holidays." I don't really find it that big of a deal.

I really have never met anybody who opted for "happy holidays" due to a dislike of Christians. I know there are some people that do have that as their primary motive, but in my own experience, I haven't come across those people. Most people I know are simply trying to be polite people who make everybody feel accepted.

Quadripedman
01-05-2007, 09:12 PM
well, you know, america is a mainly-Christian country, and we have free speech, so that means that you can pretty much say whatever you want to. i mean, im gunna say merry christmas, because its what i belive. i just cant wait to meet an athiest and ask him/her if he/she celebrates christmas...and then try to get them saved :P i love witnessing...

DarkestRose
01-05-2007, 09:18 PM
well, you know, america is a mainly-Christian country, and we have free speech, so that means that you can pretty much say whatever you want to. i mean, im gunna say merry christmas, because its what i belive. i just cant wait to meet an athiest and ask him/her if he/she celebrates christmas...and then try to get them saved :P i love witnessing...

That's cool. I really admire the urgency and passion in your desire for witnessing.

Quadripedman
01-05-2007, 09:29 PM
That's cool. I really admire the urgency and passion in your desire for witnessing.

thanks...not that i get a chance to witness much though...

DarkestRose
01-05-2007, 10:09 PM
If you really want to witness, school is probably the best place. If your school is a public school, they might have a special education class, and those students often feel really lonely and out of the loop with everybody else. Just look for all the students who are picked on, "invisible," demonized by social stigmas, ostracized, etc. Because those are kids who you can reach out to just by loving them and showing them acceptance. I think if they see that in your life, God's grace and Christ's love becomes very real to them when you share your faith. Same with kids who have pretty bad reputations. I think Christians reaching out to them as a friend is a great way to let the Spirit use your hands. It's just a suggestion, but think that is a lot of what Jesus did in His ministry and maybe what He'd do if He attended an American high school.

bloodstained87
01-05-2007, 10:20 PM
thanks...not that i get a chance to witness much though...


God will give you the opportunities. You just have to be looking--kind of like what Rose was saying.

Quadripedman
01-06-2007, 06:45 AM
yea, but im a middle schooler lol :P

NightCrawler
01-06-2007, 07:50 AM
yea, but im a middle schooler lol :P
Whatever you are doing is a witness of Christ. Right now your patterns of behaviour and choices reflect what you believe -- and people see that even if you don't say "Hey, I follow Christ! Wanna who He is?"

bubblesemm
01-06-2007, 05:47 PM
yea,just try and live like a Christian the best way that you can.

alienyouth9292
01-07-2007, 07:14 AM
sometimes the best witness is someone who merely acts Christ-like....

bubblesemm
01-08-2007, 07:55 AM
very true.

Quadripedman
01-08-2007, 03:04 PM
yea, your right. thanks.

unshakeable15
01-18-2007, 02:20 PM
sometimes the best witness is someone who merely acts Christ-like....
Not that acting like Christ isn't a good thing, but it's not the only thing. If you act like Christ, you also need to speak of him and about him and for him, otherwise, people will say "he's a good guy" or "i bet he's mormon" and they won't have the full truth behind why you do what you do.

alienyouth9292
01-18-2007, 04:21 PM
Not that acting like Christ isn't a good thing, but it's not the only thing. If you act like Christ, you also need to speak of him and about him and for him, otherwise, people will say "he's a good guy" or "i bet he's mormon" and they won't have the full truth behind why you do what you do.



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