bob
05-23-2007, 07:18 PM
So who will you be voting for?

I'm voting for Sam Brownback.

I know it's stupid to be discussin the elections when they're over a year away but with the internet and everything it's received a lot more attention already than in the past. Plus, there's not an incumbent in the race for the first time in over 40 years. The field is very wide at the moment with around 10 candidates for both parties and no clear top runners. It's rather open, which makes it exciting for me, but I'm just a dork who likes to follow politics.

Fly74
05-23-2007, 08:07 PM
I like to follow politics as well. Brownback is very worthy, I would just prefer Sen. McCain with his Iraq plan and superior Vietnam experience. Guilliani might be the republicans best chance against Sen. Clinton, but he seems to liberal on social issues for me.

terrasin
05-23-2007, 08:08 PM
I've been thinking a bit about it lately. It's really too soon to decide. All I know is this:

I will NOT be voting for Clinton.
I will NOT be voting for Obama.
I will NOT be voting for McCain.
I will NOT be voting for Edwards.

Nuff said.

CJ

NightCrawler
05-23-2007, 08:13 PM
I don't know who I will vote for, but Guliani (sp?) is supposed to have a good platform and good chance. I am probably too idealistic to vote for him though.

bob
05-23-2007, 08:23 PM
Giuliani isn't experienced in foregin policy. He refers to 9/11 in all of speeches hoping for people to remember all the heroic images of him standing on the top of rubble and directing people.

NightCrawler
05-23-2007, 09:51 PM
Giuliani isn't experienced in foregin policy.
I think someone made this comment before, "What presidents were experienced in foreign policy/What other candidates are?" -- It is important, but is it that important?

He refers to 9/11 in all of speeches hoping for people to remember all the heroic images of him standing on the top of rubble and directing people.
You're just jealous because you didn't stand on rubble directing people. Psh.

Vuren
05-23-2007, 10:12 PM
Plus, there's not an incumbent in the race for the first time in over 40 years.

correction, 8 years. you know since bill clinton couldn't run again in 2000.

bob
05-23-2007, 10:14 PM
I think someone made this comment before, "What presidents were experienced in foreign policy/What other candidates are?" -- It is important, but is it that important?


Considering the US has troops in nearly 100 contries I'd say it's rather important since we are the "world police".

You're just jealous because you didn't stand on rubble directing people. Psh.

Ha ha ha, so true. You must admit that standing on a pile of rubble could make anyone look heroic as demonstrated here by George Bush (http://www.newsday.com/media/photo/2001-09/658493.jpg).

bob
05-23-2007, 10:20 PM
correction, 8 years. you know since bill clinton couldn't run again in 2000.

When I said incumbent I was meaning that it will be the first time there isn't a President or a Vice President running.

The 2008 race will apparently be a non-incumbent or "open seat" election in which neither the sitting President nor the sitting Vice President will be a candidate, the first time since 1928.

Tromos
05-24-2007, 04:36 AM
... or a Vice President running.

Thank goodness for that.

bob
05-24-2007, 04:38 AM
He's said since 2001 he wasn't going to run for President. Plus, he doens't have the health. So even if he wanted to he couldn't.

DarkestRose
05-24-2007, 08:16 AM
You're just jealous because you didn't stand on rubble directing people. Psh.

I think it would look pretty cool to see Bob doing that, with his bread and all. ;)

terrasin
05-24-2007, 09:25 AM
Giuliani is the canidate I've been looking seriously at for quite some time. He's done amazing things with his home city and I think he could do amazing things with our country. I like a lot of the ideas he has and a lot of what he stands for, but I'm wondering how far he will get within the republican party. There are some issues that need to be cleared up though, such as that he is not pro-gay marriage, as said here:

Rudy Giuliani believes marriage is between a man and a woman. He does not - and has never - supported gay marriage. But he believes in equal rights under law for all Americans. That's why he supports domestic partnerships that provide stability for committed partners in important legal and personal matters, while preserving the sanctity of marriage between a man and a woman.

Also brought up was his stand on abortion, which is replied to here:

Rudy Giuliani supports reasonable restrictions on abortion such as parental notification with a judicial bypass and a ban on partial birth abortion – except when the life of the mother is at stake. He’s proud that adoptions increased 66% while abortions decreased over 16% in New York City when he was Mayor. But Rudy understands that this is a deeply personal moral dilemma, and people of good conscience can disagree respectfully.

Thus far, my vote will be going to him. He seems to have the best head on his shoulders. I need to look up information on what he thinks about immigration though... *goes off to look*

CJ

bob
05-24-2007, 10:07 AM
I'm interested to hear his stance on immigration.

riz
05-24-2007, 02:10 PM
I def think Rudy Giuliani is one of the better Republican candidates, and I could see myself voting for him when the time comes...

alienyouth9292
05-24-2007, 06:05 PM
republicans just need to all have allegiance for one person who has a chance to beat Clinton or Osama(not a typo)so that we may have a chance to save our country from them lol. i just think that we need to vote for whoever has the best chance to win.

bob
05-24-2007, 06:45 PM
i just think that we need to vote for whoever has the best chance to win.

Yeah . . . I don't cast my vote for someone I don't agree with simply for a particular party. :P Whie I do side with the Republican party I'm not willing to vote based on party lines. If everyone jumped off a cliff, would you? Sort of along those lines of thinking. ;)

Fly74
05-24-2007, 07:38 PM
I agree somewhat, but when it's between Obama and Clinton vs. republican, I can definitely see myself bending my own beliefs for the sake of reblicans.

alorian
05-24-2007, 10:04 PM
I'm really not sure yet. I have a few candidates I know I WON'T be voting for, for sure. Maybe I won't vote.... keep me out of jury duty.... haha :P I'm not sure whether I'll even go rebublican or democrat on this one *shrugs* I need to wait and do more research

riz
05-27-2007, 06:36 AM
i just think that we need to vote for whoever has the best chance to win.

Wouldn't it be smarter to vote for the candidate you agree with most?

terrasin
05-27-2007, 10:40 AM
I agree somewhat, but when it's between Obama and Clinton vs. republican, I can definitely see myself bending my own beliefs for the sake of reblicans.
That will be taken care of in the primaries. Only one of them will be running for office after that.

CJ

TheFireBreathes
05-27-2007, 01:32 PM
I'm missing voting in '08 by 4 months >:(
lame.

But if I could, I'd go for Romney. I like his ideas, and so what if he's mormon? at least they have morals

Fly74
05-27-2007, 07:57 PM
I miss voting by one month in the next election. I think I would vote for either McCain or Romney. Guiliani just hasn't proven to be conservative enough on social issues but maybe that'll gain him the ind. vote.

bob
05-27-2007, 08:09 PM
But if I could, I'd go for Romney. I like his ideas, and so what if he's mormon? at least they have morals

Rommney wants to institue universal healthcare. I think that's a horrible idea.

alorian
05-29-2007, 12:16 AM
You probably have health insurance though. There are those of us that don't, and in my case at least if an 18 year old person without insurance suddenly has some medical issue and sinks them into medical debt a few thousand dollars right off the bat as they're trying to start of their lives..... well it's not fun.

NightCrawler
05-29-2007, 08:12 AM
You probably have health insurance though. There are those of us that don't, and in my case at least if an 18 year old person without insurance suddenly has some medical issue and sinks them into medical debt a few thousand dollars right off the bat as they're trying to start of their lives..... well it's not fun.
Okay, nice scenario... but that is not the gov's obligation to meet the hypothetical 18 year old's needs. That is the churches' obligation if anyone but himself.

alorian
05-31-2007, 11:43 AM
I completely agree with you actually heh, just trying to spark a bit of discussion ;) (And I am meeting those needs which is sorely difficult :P Yay for family support, and yay for churches not helping haha)

unshakeable15
05-31-2007, 02:43 PM
I'm trying my best not think about the election until it's actually, i don't know, an election year.

But thanks to Bob bringing this up, i am. :P Guliani, so far, has stood out to me. But, again, i'm trying not to pay attention, so a shiny penny would attract my attention.

bob
05-31-2007, 06:55 PM
Good luck at trying to not pay attention to it. The media is going crazy over it. The internet also puts more pressure into it. And I guess since our current President is so unpopular with the masses, that puts more focus on it.

eowyn
05-31-2007, 07:29 PM
Okay, nice scenario... but that is not the gov's obligation to meet the hypothetical 18 year old's needs. That is the churches' obligation if anyone but himself.

You are exactly exactly on target. Most of the nurses I know.. understand what a BAD idea that universal healthcare really really is. It is an ugly place to be, really.

I'm registered as a Republican .. but I'm soo tempted to vote democrat..but only if Obama wins the primaries..

*ducks* please don't throw rocks!

I would just like to say:

IT'S NEVER ! too early to talk about politics.. I cannot wait for all of the campaign hype to begin..especially with a couple of states trying to match Illinois' primary dates..that will make things very .. INTERESTING indeed.

Let the Games begin. And the Campaign $$$ flow.

And please, please let there be a scream like Howard Dean.. and if someone could please referance an OutKast song!? Those are my election wishes!!

NightCrawler
05-31-2007, 07:47 PM
And please, please let there be a scream like Howard Dean.. and if someone could please referance an OutKast song!? Those are my election wishes!!
Sigh.

Or "I invented the internet" or anything similar. I am really expecting humans to be themselves -- so I am hoping that we all get a good laugh.

eowyn
06-01-2007, 12:03 PM
Ah..who can hate politics with men like Howard Dean around to entertain us.

DarkestRose
06-01-2007, 12:07 PM
^Those are good reminders of all the funs times in politics, especially good now because I was beginning to feel like things were getting boring.

bob
06-01-2007, 04:56 PM
Fred Thomspon is planning to announce his candidacy around the 4th of July. That's all we need, another candidate. :P

eowyn
06-01-2007, 05:21 PM
The primaries will solve most of this..along with the main media outlets..

bob
06-01-2007, 05:30 PM
Yeah, the media has sided with Obama, Clinton, Giuliani, and McCain so far.

alorian
06-02-2007, 09:45 AM
Mmmmm, four of the candidates I do not want to vote for.

skilletfreak101
06-02-2007, 04:02 PM
you know what sucks for me? i will be just TWO MONTHS shy of being 18 when election time comes around...i'm pretty angry :-P

unshakeable15
06-04-2007, 04:15 PM
Fred Thomspon is planning to announce his candidacy around the 4th of July. That's all we need, another candidate. :P
Isn't that an announcement in itself, the leak of the announcement? I've never understood this aspect of the media...

DarkestRose
06-04-2007, 04:20 PM
Hilary Clinton is having a song contest for her campaign song. You can vote. I found that funny. But even though she is one of the last people I would vote for, I voted because I like the KT Tunstall song that was winning.

http://www.hillaryclinton.com/action/spotlight/?sc=8

eowyn
06-05-2007, 12:11 PM
It makes me laugh, the number of candidates at each side's primary debate. That's not a debate..its a stampede.

bob
06-05-2007, 03:50 PM
What's up with the whole "Raise your hand if you agree with this" thing at the debates? So lame. :P

DarkestRose
06-05-2007, 04:03 PM
What's up with the whole "Raise your hand if you agree with this" thing at the debates? So lame. :P

Raise your hand if you agree.

bob
06-05-2007, 08:12 PM
So did anyone watch the Republican debate tonight?

NightCrawler
06-06-2007, 05:06 PM
holy crap! I missed it!

bob
06-06-2007, 08:13 PM
Was that sarcasm? I'm very bad at picking up on it.

DarkestRose
06-06-2007, 08:19 PM
I read about it online a bit, but only the parts about illegal immigration.

I don't have cable channels on our TV except for PBS and I never watch that channel.

Quadripedman
06-06-2007, 09:05 PM
yea, i saw a few clips on it on tv. i like how one of the people's (cant remember who it was for the life of me) microphones shorted out because of "lightening" while they were talking about abortion and stuff like that.

i would probally vote for obama, if i could vote, but i cant, so that doesnt really matter. however, i have noticed that ive been leaning towards republican a lot more since i became a Christian. really, i would vote for the person who i agreed with the stands of for the most part (if that made any sence at all lol...)

bob
06-07-2007, 02:31 AM
yea, i saw a few clips on it on tv. i like how one of the people's (cant remember who it was for the life of me) microphones shorted out because of "lightening" while they were talking about abortion and stuff like that.


That was Giuliani who's mic shorted out. Ironically it was during his answer to his stance on abortion. They joked that it was a "sign from above".

DarkestRose
06-07-2007, 02:35 AM
I am frustrated with how Giuliani claims to be personally against abortion but still will work to make it legal.

NightCrawler
06-07-2007, 05:57 AM
I am frustrated with how Giuliani claims to be personally against abortion but still will work to make it legal.
Here is an odd thought:
Marijuana should be legal as there is nothing inherently wrong with it, but people should not get high. Contrast of legality vs morality. I disagree with Guliani IF that is the difference he is making for abortion. But given the arguments I have seen for that stance, I can see where he would be coming from (though disagreeing completely myself).

bob
06-07-2007, 08:43 AM
I still don't really understand Romney's health care plan.

eowyn
06-08-2007, 01:57 PM
I read about it online a bit, but only the parts about illegal immigration.

I don't have cable channels on our TV except for PBS and I never watch that channel.

You should! It's pretty much the best channel ever..:afro:

TheFireBreathes
06-08-2007, 09:08 PM
how did brownback do? i didnt get to watch it

bob
06-09-2007, 11:58 AM
how did brownback do? i didnt get to watch it

I really liked his answer to the question "What is the number one moral problem in America?" But since Brownback has been shoved into the category of a "second tier" candidate the media hasn't given him much attention.

Quadripedman
06-09-2007, 05:41 PM
hmmm...just a question...what would his answer to that question actually be? lol i didnt get to see it ::] :(

bob
06-09-2007, 10:42 PM
hmmm...just a question...what would his answer to that question actually be? lol i didnt get to see it ::] :(

Next question comes from you, sir. Your name is Max Latona.

Q Yes, it is.

MS. VAUGHN: You live in Manchester, New Hampshire. What do you do for a living, sir?

Q I teach philosophy here at St. Anselm College.

MS. VAUGHN: Whatís your question tonight?

Q My question is a simple one. In your opinion, what is the most pressing moral issue facing this country today? And if youíre elected president, how would you address that issue?


SEN. BROWNBACK: Thank you, and thank you for the question from a philosopher.

I think itís a life issue clearly, and I am pro-life and Iím whole life. And one of the things Iím the most, the proudest about our party about is that weíve stood for life. Weíve been a party that has stood for a culture of life, and it was in our platform in 1980 and it continues today.

And with that respect ó and I have respect for my other colleagues ó thatís why I donít think we can nominate somebody thatís not pro-life in this party because it is at our core. We believe that every life is beautiful, is sacred, is a child of a loving God, from natural ó from conception to natural death, and that applies not only here and in the womb, it applies to somebody thatís in poverty, it applies to the child in Darfur.

And that philosophy, being pro-life and whole life, is something I think can really help move us forward as a country and as a party.

The full debate transcript can be found here (http://www.cfr.org/publication/13549/), I'd highly recommend skimming it at least.

DarkestRose
06-09-2007, 11:19 PM
I like that answer. I think it is a very important issue and it definitely does dictate who I vote for. This is largely why I end up voting Republican. I love a lot of the social-oriented ideals of the Democratic party but Democratic politicians are so often pro-choice that I cannot in good conscience vote for them.

Quadripedman
06-10-2007, 06:58 AM
*applauds*

taht was an awesome answer!

bob
06-10-2007, 10:55 AM
Mike Huckabee gave a pretty good answer as well:

MS. VAUGHN: Governor Huckabee, you are an ordained minister. What is the most pressing moral issue in this country?

MR. HUCKABEE: Well, it looks like I’m getting all the moral questions tonight, and I guess that’s a good thing. (Laughter.) That’s better than getting the immoral questions. (Laughter.) So I’m happy to get those.

I really believe that if you define in — a moral issue, it is our respect, our sanctity and our understanding of the value of every single human life, because that is what makes America a unique place on this planet. We value every life of an individual as if it represents the life of us all.

Many of us who are pro-life, quite frankly, I think, have made the mistake of giving people the impression that pro-life means we care intensely about people as long as that child is in the womb, but beyond the gestation period, we’ve not demonstrated as demonstrably as we should that we respect life at all levels, not just during pregnancy.

We shouldn’t allow a child to live under a bridge or in the back seat of a car.

We shouldn’t be satisfied that elderly people are being abused and neglected in nursing homes. It should never be acceptable to us that people are treated as expendable — any people. But the unique part of our country is that we elevate and we celebrate human life.

And if you look at us with the contrast of the Islamic jihadists, who would strap a bomb to the belly of their own child, march him into a crowded room, set the detonator and kill innocent people, they celebrate death, we celebrate life. It’s the fundamental thing that makes us unique and it keeps us free. I pray we never, ever abandon that basic principle.

DarkestRose
06-10-2007, 11:15 AM
That was a good answer too! I do agree that pro-lifers have a tendency to seem like we only care about those in the womb and that does need to change.

stillaiming
06-11-2007, 05:25 PM
The poor you will have with you always.

I think we have to be careful about relying on the government to do what the church has failed at ....

I do not fault government that insists that it was not ever designed to be a welfare management organization...

The church is commanded to take care of the poor...

So when we look at the government to pick up the slack...... when we do that we look at the governement as the "church"... sounding familiar yet.... i will give you a hint socialist humanism, marxism and communism...

We release a spirit of murder on this nation when we condone capital punishment.... revenge is an evil and unrelenting taskmaster..... now we act insulted at the passage of roe v wade..... and are aghaast at the abortion rate and applaud reform efforts against abortion as holy and righteous.......


puleeeez......

we need to fall on our faces and cry out to god for his forgiveness for taking any life........ the life of the axe murderer that we executed and the holy spirit was not quite finished with .....so he went to hell because we shortened the Lord's time to work with him and played God with his life and doomed him to hell.....

do not want to scare you or say in any way i condone abortion ...... BUT at least the aborted child is rejoicing and dancing in heaven ........ but we took the man's free will from him and his ability to seek forgiveness from the God who forgives us and told him he was TOO bad for God's forgiveness


ALL abortion and ALL killing is wrong under any circumstances....

we as a nation live under a murderous curse and it will only be lifted when ALL murder is outlawed and grace is poured out on all people


just stirring the pot:evil:

DarkestRose
06-11-2007, 06:21 PM
If God is against the death penalty, why did He originally command it? Or why did God command that the Israelites utterly destroy different nations? Murder and execution are two different animals, just as murder and war are two different animals. Murder is a crime. Execution is the punishment for the crime.

It is not the case that people who are for capital punishment believe that people on death row are “too bad” for God’s forgiveness. It is not an issue of sin but an issue of crime. We have prison’s ministries and such that reach out to these people, so it’s not the case that Christians are dismissive of those imprisoned. The problem is that it is the state that is in charge of justice against murderers, rapist, robbers, and other violent criminals. The state has no priority about people and their conversions. The state does not pardon prisoners because of a conversion to Christianity. If that were so, it is likely that many would fake conversions in order to get out of their sentence. People can be saved, but crimes still need to be punished.

bob
06-11-2007, 07:38 PM
I agree completely with you DarkestRose.

And stillaiming. We spell our God's name with a capital G since he is the only god.